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Thread: My Case for Camo

  1. #21
    Senior Member Aurelius95's Avatar
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    Nice job with the concealment. I had a hard time spotting you, except in the first picture (need to work on that!).
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  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winter View Post
    I always wear camo and/or earth tones. I feel it is rude to be easily seen. It ruins other peoples feelings of solitude.
    There is actually a trend in camping gear to make it in earth toned colors so camp grounds don't appear as crowded.
    Last edited by Alaskan Survivalist; 09-18-2010 at 05:31 PM.

  3. #23
    Ed edr730's Avatar
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    Camophlage may have some tiny little effect (except for birds). I could never detect any difference except though the eyes of a human. Movement is what an animal can see whether you wear camophlage, orange, or red . What hides movement is something like trees behind you. Pines, for some reason, can hide you very good.

  4. #24

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    Hey, camouflage is my favorite color!

  5. #25
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by edr730 View Post
    Camophlage may have some tiny little effect (except for birds). I could never detect any difference except though the eyes of a human. Movement is what an animal can see whether you wear camophlage, orange, or red . What hides movement is something like trees behind you. Pines, for some reason, can hide you very good.
    Camoflauge also breaks up shape that can be seen by anything with an eyeball. Besides not all animals are color blind and some can just see some colors. It all depends on the animal.

    Just being concerned about animals seeing you is a very narrow focus of the potential of camoflauge.

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskan Survivalist
    I've heard even some hunters reject it as well…
    Count me among these hunters – at least for big game hunting purposes. I do own some camo clothing that I bought or was given years ago and haven’t yet worn out, but I go out of my way to avoid camo clothing nowadays. I prefer clothing in just natural earth tones.

    Animals of the various deer and deer-like species (moose, elk, mule deer, whitetail, blacktail, pronghorn, etc.) do not see in color. Their vision is mostly attuned to movement. This is hard for most people to understand because we are so accustomed to thinking of vision from within our own paradigms and marketing for hunting clothing is very good at targeting things that seem to make sense because they can demonstrate it with pictures, but which are still based in false notions. For example, the fact that I can't see someone wearing camo in a picture, is an interesting, though not necessarily accurate "portrait" (pun intended) of reality. The picture you are looking at has (at least) two problems.
    1. It is a 2D image
    2. It is limited in contrast and resolution by the camera itself and the medium on which it is being viewed. Cameras cannot generally present individual photographs with the full range of subtle differences in contrast, tone, definition, etc. that the eye can see. That's one of the reasons a lot of landscape photography has gone to the process of HDR (High Dynamic Range) photography. So too, all the depth in normal photographs has been "flattened" by the placement of the ink on the paper (or the pixels on the screen).

    Reality includes an almost infinite array of subtle differences in lighting, contrast and tone and is in 3D, and just because you can't be seen in the picture, doesn't mean you couldn't be seen by the guy taking that same picture.

    The simple fact is however, that these animals don’t see things the same way we do and camo clothing does not aid in making one invisible to them. Painfully slow movements, whilst positioning oneself downwind is the key.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskan Survivalist
    …not all animals are color blind and some can just see some colors.
    I agree. One notable example of this is with birds. Most birds see the full spectrum of color and so; camouflage can be a real asset. So my waders for duck/goose/crane hunting and such all sport camo patterns as do the clothes I would wear hunting turkey. Nevertheless marketing geniuses still prey on our oft-mistaken perceptions and biases to try to get us to buy new waders, coats, etc. every year with the latest in camo patterns. Truth be told, just about any pattern that will break up your outline and is in colors normally associated with the terrain your hunting will do just fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskan Survivalist
    Just being concerned about animals seeing you is a very narrow focus of the potential of camoflauge.
    This is true and, if your purpose is to hide from people, then camo can definitely be of benefit. Having said that, if you stick to basic earth tones and other colors natural to the environment you’re in and if you are careful to limit the amount of movement and noise you make, you can usually do every bit as good at hiding from others as can people wearing camouflage. Use the natural environment itself to aid in concealment and you can do even better. Camo is, IMO, the manly, outdoor person’s “high fashion” and I’ve seen guys just as worried about what brand/pattern/color of camo they were wearing as their teenage daughters fretting over what label is on their latest pair of jeans or what shoes they’re wearing.

    Camo isn't going to hurt anyone's (big game) hunting efforts, but it isn't likely to help much either.

    As a side (though somewhat related) note; did you guys hear that recently the vice president for marketing for Scent-Lock clothing as well as the scientist who originally developed their line of clothes both were made to admit in open court proceedings that their clothes do not work as advertised?!?
    Last edited by lucznik; 09-20-2010 at 06:23 PM.

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by lucznik View Post
    As a side (though somewhat related) note; did you guys hear that recently the vice president for marketing for Scent-Lock clothing as well as the scientist who originally developed their line of clothes both were made to admit in open court proceedings that their clothes do not work as advertised?!?

    I been trying to tell people that whole scent lock/elimination thing was a joke.

  9. #29

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    lukznik, Good comment. I agree with all you said to a varrying degree especially the part that other factors are just as if not more important when hunting. Much of my interest comes from the perspective that we will become the hunted in the coarse of every day survival in the future. To many that is over top thinking and I pray they are right.

  10. #30
    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    lukznik, I agree.
    I still think the orginal camo was a brown barn coat, with muddy lab prints on it.
    So now you need a new pattern every year, because the animals now "reconize" Real Tree?

    Used to drive me nuts going in to a bar, and seeing guys with mis-matched camo.

    Made me want to have them all strip, throw every thing into a pile, then start over.

    You,....you get the wild leaf x-treamo, and you.......you get the real rock high light, and you...you get the deep water skyline and so forth. LOL
    The more you spend, the "cooler" you will look..... to people!
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  11. #31

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    Camo uses many tricks of the eye beyond color. Some of my British DPM even uses texture. This face mask is part of my winter gear and the color is much darker than my overwhites but is designed to blur at a distance. It works very good.

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    I'm learning from S.E.R.E. trained people I have met online and train on a regular basis locally and been impressed with thier capability not to be seen, heard or even leave a trace. My survival plan is based more on homesteading/pioneering methods that I know well but if things get bad I'll need a way to get from here to there. Gathering food is easy for me but like I've said those activities may become illegal and I can see the possibility that I may even need camo to go clam digging.

  12. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by hunter63 View Post

    Used to drive me nuts going in to a bar, and seeing guys with mis-matched camo.

    Made me want to have them all strip, throw every thing into a pile, then start over.

    You,....you get the wild leaf x-treamo, and you.......you get the real rock high light, and you...you get the deep water skyline and so forth. LOL
    The more you spend, the "cooler" you will look..... to people!
    Now if you'd have said, "make all the cute gals strip" I'd have supported you all the way. But with the guys, well... You're on your own there.

  13. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaskan Survivalist View Post
    I'm learning from S.E.R.E. trained people...
    There's a TV documentary series available for watching on HULU that followed a group of SERE students from day 1 through graduation. Neither these guys nor their instructors struck me as being real "outdoorsy" types. I'm sure what they teach has good military applications, but would be severely limited in most other circumstances, especially hunting.

  14. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by lucznik View Post
    There's a TV documentary series available for watching on HULU that followed a group of SERE students from day 1 through graduation. Neither these guys nor their instructors struck me as being real "outdoorsy" types. I'm sure what they teach has good military applications, but would be severely limited in most other circumstances, especially hunting.
    I'm helping them with the "outdoorsy" stuff. I would not be asking them how to fix my washing machine either but they know E&E well.

  15. #35
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    You guys know that Sarky was a SERE instructor right?
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  16. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by crashdive123 View Post
    You guys know that Sarky was a SERE instructor right?
    I didn't know that and I did not mean to imply they had no skills just that I have local knowledge that could be helpful to anyone. I recognize thier skill as they recognize mine. A person does not have to know all things about everything for me to learn from them. Just know what they are talking about.

  17. #37
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    I didn't think that you were implying anything. I just thought he might be a possible resourse for some questions that folks may have.
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  18. #38

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    I always hope that more knowledgeable people get enticed to comment on threads. So how do we get Sarky to chime in?

  19. #39
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    I know that not everybody reads every section, or is on-line as often as others. Don't know if he's seen this thread or not. I suppose you could send him a pm with a link to this thread to call his attention to it and ask for his input.
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  20. #40

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    Done............

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