View Full Version : Hunting to Eat
I was just reading an article on how the indigenous folks in Gabon hunt. It seems they string up nets on the edge of the forest and then drive animals into the nets. Small game gets its neck broken with a machete while larger game might be killed with a shotgun, if they have a shell. It seems every available man and boy is involved in a hunt and the meat is equally divided for everyone in the village.
Several things struck me about the article. We talk a LOT about bugging out and living on our own while some of us talk about bugging in and rebuilding the community. It takes a lot of energy to hunt and the more that join in the better the chances of success. A group synergy forms enabling a few to achieve what each one on his own would not be able to. For example, while some are driving the animals toward the net, some members are waiting to dispatch the animals.
The use of nets to entrap the animals uses less resources than shooting and less energy than chasing. The village dogs are even used in driving the animals toward the nets thereby reducing the energy expended by the people.
Finally, the village does not take any more meat than they are capable of cooking, eating or smoking before it spoils. And they use just about every part of the animal.
In most villages around the world hunting is a team effort. I'm sure that time has proven that hunting parties are much more effective. Just one more thing to consider in the over plan of what to do if something should happen and you need to decide if you should but out or in.
BENESSE
10-12-2009, 07:47 PM
Just one more thing to consider in the over plan of what to do if something should happen and you need to decide if you should but out or in.
How do you mean Rick?
Don't mean to go simple on you, just trying to understand how to relate it to where I am.
COWBOYSURVIVAL
10-12-2009, 07:49 PM
We have all been hunting and not even seen our intended prey...however pretty rare I couldn't have at least gotten a family size meal out of a hunt. Not sure if I agree that it is better in a group....
Pal334
10-12-2009, 08:37 PM
I think the concept is at least worth thinking about and keeping in the old "tool bag". It has obviously worked from the start of recorded history and is apparently still working. If you find ourself in a group situation, seems to be the most economical use of resources
pocomoonskyeyes
10-12-2009, 10:43 PM
That's why in some places in the US, Dog hunting Deer is allowed(Vegetation so thick you couldn't see it walking just a few yards away)they(Dogs) make the "Drive" and hunters are prepositioned along the expected route. It can be very effective if done right. Stand hunting in those same areas is VERY "iffy" at best,assuming you have done all your preseason scouting,etc. Stalking in these areas.... You had best be better than the Apaches were at disappearing,more silent than wind on an owls wings,as odorless as pure Mountain air. Otherwise you are just out walking in the woods....with a gun.
Yeah I see where hunting in a group,and working a drive is better than hunting alone... A lot better. Better to have a little deer meat than an empty belly, or a rabbit, or coon or whatever.
panch0
10-12-2009, 11:48 PM
Those folks probably also plant and harvest to add to their diet.
Winnie
10-13-2009, 04:15 AM
We still use a long net method here for rabbits, hares and foxes. It's very a very efficient form of hunting and you can be selective about what is taken for the pot. It's best with more than one person though, and dogs are a great help. I've done it once or twice many years ago with a friend.
your_comforting_company
10-13-2009, 07:27 AM
I, personally, do not hunt for sport. I'm not after a trophy, I'm after feeding myself and my family.
Normally, 2 or 3 of the men-folk will go out into the woods, usually before first light on a new moon. (for this example I will use our normal 2-man hunting party). One of us will position ourself on the expected flush route and the other will move slowly from the opposite end of the hunted area in an attempt to flush the animal toward the stationary member.
using this technique we harvested 9 deer last year between 3 hunters and two of us still have meat in the freezer.
This technique is ancient and the natives used similar tactics with the buffalo, and deer.
Though they used natural barriers and traps and did not waste time nor resources on "nets" and other type traps. (why would you if you could run them to a cliff edge and not fire any arrows?) I don't have the book handy, but there was a 4-book set from time life books that detailed many of the tactics used by natives. I didn't realize the efficiency of party hunting until a few years ago.
Once the hunt was conducted, the entire tribes would come to the "trap scene" and everyone would systematically butcher the animals, some would move the meat, some move the leftover parts to a mass burial site, and others back at camp would continue processing.
This does add a lot of perspective to whether a person could make it on their own vs. in a group. I have been hunting many times right by myself and can honestly say that I have only brought home food twice in this way, but, like I said, last year 3 of us managed to get food for 3 families for a whole year, sharing the bounty of the hunt equally.
I say a small group is quite effective, while singular hunting will leave you hungry if you are only stalking big game. small game, on the other hand, seem to be less elusive and more curious, i.e. squirrels, coons, coots, etc. and you stand a better chance of procuring a meal if you just 'lower the bar'.
How do you mean Rick?
Don't mean to go simple on you, just trying to understand how to relate it to where I am.
So many folks are loners. Probably just in their nature. They want to fall back to some secluded spot and survive by themselves or just their immediate family. I'm just saying there are advantages to working in a community environment. As PAL pointed out, hunting in groups has been going on forever.
Not sure if I agree that it is better in a group....
I don't know if it's better or not but you clearly expend less energy in a group since the work is divided among the members. And expending less energy when in a survival situation is what it's all about.
Good post YCC. Utilizing natural barriers be it cliff, rock wall, briars, water, etc., is an excellent use of your environment to your advantage.
pocomoonskyeyes
10-13-2009, 09:28 AM
If I had a choice, I would rather be part of a community. I think it would increase the efficiency of a survival scenario. Just 2 people "halves" the work". 1 Person could work on "camp" while 1 gathers food.Add more people it gets easier. Yes there are more mouths to feed, but more hands to help contribute. If it's either Stew or going hungry,then it's a simple choice really.
rwc1969
10-13-2009, 10:18 AM
Small groups are much more efficient at hunting and living in general. It would be extremely difficult for an individual to make it in the wild, too many things to do on a daily basis for one person to make it. Whereas, a group would have a much easier time. In fact, if the SHTF the groups would survive and the loners would parish. I am a loner of sorts so that's hard to take, but it's the reality of the situation.
It would be very easy for a group to drive deer into a lake and then pummel them to death at leisure. Especially when another part of that group is home gettin the fire ready, out gathering veggies, etc..
BENESSE
10-13-2009, 11:00 AM
Small groups are much more efficient at hunting and living in general. It would be extremely difficult for an individual to make it in the wild, too many things to do on a daily basis for one person to make it. Whereas, a group would have a much easier time. In fact, if the SHTF the groups would survive and the loners would parish. I am a loner of sorts so that's hard to take, but it's the reality of the situation.
Another important benefit of a group is security. To me it rates just as high.
Sourdough
10-13-2009, 11:22 AM
I don't know if it's better or not but you clearly expend less energy in a group since the work is divided among the members. And expending less energy when in a survival situation is what it's all about.
How much work are you going to get out of FAT & LAZY People. Most people know less about "WORK" than any subject knowable to humans.
2dumb2kwit
10-13-2009, 11:43 AM
How much work are you going to get out of FAT & LAZY People. Most people know less about "WORK" than any subject knowable to humans.
That brings up a good point.
What if you're in a small group, and one of the members won't pull their weight? Do you kill them? Do you make them leave the group? If they won't work hard in the group, do you think they will survive without the group.
COWBOYSURVIVAL
10-13-2009, 11:50 AM
I am now firmly convinced I am in the right area to sustain my family by hunting and foraging alone. I can't walk out my back door without literally tripping over edible wildlife. I am also convinced I am the loner that will have to do the work. But you know everytime I get the opportunity to do this work I enjoy every second, so nah! I ain't gonna need a net. I would like to watch you guys give it a go though, so let me know when you guys are ready to try it! LOL
Ricks hollaring to Poco Get the Net! Get the Net!
BENESSE
10-13-2009, 12:17 PM
There are so many variables, the biggest being, what SHTF scenario you find yourself in and where you are when it happens.
Given the choice, I'd rather be part of a like-minded group than alone.
But then, I'd rather be alone than part of a bunch of lazy lumps and loose cannons. You all know it's bad enough having to deal with them when all's well.
How much work are you going to get out of FAT & LAZY People. Most people know less about "WORK" than any subject knowable to humans.
Henry Ford once said, "Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work." Of course, both of you may have been hanging around the wrong crowd.
CS, I find it hard to believe that you think you can harvest more food or as much food alone and a group can. Isn't that similar to saying you can move more dirt, build a shed faster, dig a ditch deeper, by yourself that if a group were involved?
crashdive123
10-13-2009, 01:35 PM
That brings up a good point.
What if you're in a small group, and one of the members won't pull their weight? Do you kill them? Do you make them leave the group? If they won't work hard in the group, do you think they will survive without the group.
I think that it would be important to find something that they are able to do. They may not have the physical stamina to help with the hunt, but there may be many other chores that they are good at. I gathered a big bag of acorns the other day. After shelling, soaking to get out the tannins and grinding - I will use it as a four. Very time consuming process, and with somebody else in a group it would make much lighter work of things. As in any wilderness living situation - it is hard work - and there is a lot of it. Some will be more capable of certain tasks than others.
2dumb2kwit
10-13-2009, 02:07 PM
I agree with you, crash, but I didn't mean someone who was unable to, I meant someone who "chose" not to do the work. (As in, just plain lazy.)
crashdive123
10-13-2009, 02:08 PM
Group dynamics would probably resolve the issue.
Long pig.
COWBOYSURVIVAL
10-13-2009, 02:27 PM
Henry Ford once said, "Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work." Of course, both of you may have been hanging around the wrong crowd.
CS, I find it hard to believe that you think you can harvest more food or as much food alone and a group can. Isn't that similar to saying you can move more dirt, build a shed faster, dig a ditch deeper, by yourself that if a group were involved?
Never said I could harvest as much or more than a group only that I fealt I could provide enough for my family of three without a group or a net. Oh and if I see someone in my woods, hollaring "get the net" well then......Just sayin' might be some consideration where you guys go a nettin'.
pocomoonskyeyes
10-13-2009, 02:39 PM
I agree with you, crash, but I didn't mean someone who was unable to, I meant someone who "chose" not to do the work. (As in, just plain lazy.)
That would be simple really - Don't contribute , don't expect any of the "fruits of the labor". A day or two without food or shelter would "Motivate" them.
2dumb2kwit
10-13-2009, 03:01 PM
Never said I could harvest as much or more than a group only that I fealt I could provide enough for my family of three without a group or a net. Oh and if I see someone in my woods, hollaring "get the net" well then......Just sayin' might be some consideration where you guys go a nettin'.
You know...I've been told, that game starts tasting like whatever it's been eating. Rick eats a lot of twinkies. Just sayin'.:innocent:
@CS - Got you. If all else fails, there's horse roasts.
@2D - Would you please stop calling me lazy?! Just because I choose not to work.....
your_comforting_company
10-13-2009, 08:32 PM
That brings up a good point.
What if you're in a small group, and one of the members won't pull their weight? don't let them have any of the stuff the rest of the group worked for
Do you kill them? No. when you kill people they call it murder, unless it's someone important, then it's asassination. murder is bad.
Do you make them leave the group? if they still won't help, yes. they gotta go.
If they won't work hard in the group, do you think they will survive without the group.let's hope not. I'm getting hungry and they won't wander far on their own...:whistling:
at least thats my answers...
COWBOYSURVIVAL
10-13-2009, 08:46 PM
Rick, Got me huh! well I'll tell you what "Buddy" (understand me and Rick are pickin') You and three more just like ya, come on down and I'll let you guys head out with your nets and clubs. Me I'll take a silent but deadly stand at sundown.......I get one bullet for each of you so 4 bullets and I know I have to feed my family.....simple math.....The bullets are for the critters not you guys!
2dumb2kwit
10-13-2009, 09:01 PM
@2D - Would you please stop calling me lazy?! Just because I choose not to work.....
Ohhhh, come on now Rick. I wasn't calling you lazy. *I was calling you flavored.*:innocent:
@CS - I'm certainly glad you cleared up who the bullets were for. I was beginning to think we might need to trap you with the net when you walk at the door.
@2D - Well, okay then.
lucznik
10-21-2009, 06:44 PM
I don't think we can consider it an accident that humans around the world and throughout history have tended to congregate together into villages, tribes, communities, nations, or whatever. Man does not generally do well alone.
I know there are lots of cool stories about Mountain Men and their travels/adventures into the old American West that are adventurous and exciting. Trust me, their existence was almost universally meager and uncomfortable and all but the very best (luckiest) tended to die very early.
I think, if I really was going to be in a true, extended bug-out scenario, I would want (at the very least) to congregate together with my extended family group and perhaps a few well-chosen others - make up a "tribe," if you will.. There are lots of skills to be had among that group of people that would be very nice to have available.
Stony
10-25-2009, 01:55 PM
well, it did not take long to turn this thread into a name-calling and cussing exercise.
while surveying forest tracts i see more small game than large,
therefore a small game rig (.22 handgun or 410 shotgun) would do the trick.
maybe aided by a good ,mid-sized, dog.
when hunting in a group, the girls and i split up, one taking a stand and two walking.
this way we seen 11 deer yesterday morning (one hour).
here you go, my take on things.
now the usual suspects can start rantin and rafing again.
That would be me. Let's see, should I pick on Cowboy or 2Dumb? Someone pick for me.
nell67
10-25-2009, 05:51 PM
That would be me. Let's see, should I pick on Cowboy or 2Dumb? Someone pick for me.
I vote stony,maybe we should start a poll and see what everyone else thinks??
Working together as a group is the efficient and also the lazy why.
I know what your saying 2D, the lazy ones should be shunned from the village to feed the animals for the next hunt.
Village Hunting is done here in the U.S. only we call it a "Drive" where hunters scour the woods in a line and jump deer. I have never done this, never need too or wanted to, I do fine solo hunting for me and the family. But, in an extreme situation I might try it if I knew and trusted the others carrying the firearms. Won't go hunting with a group of people that would spray the woods when the game jumps up to run... just me but I'm kinda not into being shot at by fellow hunters.
Beo,
crashdive123
10-26-2009, 07:55 AM
.. just me but I'm kinda not into being shot at by fellow hunters.
Beo,
Now that you're arse has healed up, I'm sure there is a joke in that statement somewhere.
LOL... yeah, I seem to attract injuries... my arse is fine now though thanks for asking.
There's something that's been alluded to here a couple of times that I think is the most important deciding factor. Competence. The people who traditionally hunted for food in groups knew that the other hunters in the group had the same training and each person knew their job plus they come from a society that valued the group's wellbeing over the individual's for the most part. Those things are going to make a world of difference.
I don't mind hunting with someone else if I'm confident in their core competencies. Just most people I'm not. The larger a group of hunters becomes the greater the odds of chasing away your intended prey by making too much ruckus in the bush too, though.
BENESSE
10-26-2009, 05:58 PM
I don't mind hunting with someone else if I'm confident in their core competencies. Just most people I'm not. The larger a group of hunters becomes the greater the odds of chasing away your intended prey by making too much ruckus in the bush too, though.
Not to mention you might get shot in the face.
chiggersngrits
10-26-2009, 10:55 PM
I think the most beneficial aspect of the group would be if one was to become sick or injured. You would have someone to help care for you, increasing your chances to recover. The group would also cover your duties until you were able to resume them.
Add to that the fact that you exponentially increase the level of knowledge with a group. We see it demonstrated here every day.
Nativedude
10-26-2009, 11:33 PM
Why do you think the Natives generally hunted in groups? 'Nuff said! :cool2:
Because they hunted giant herds of buffalo, in the east they went out in groups but did not do drives but broke into smaller groups usually in pairs. Want the source of information on that I actually have it :) so I had to post it.
rwc1969
10-27-2009, 11:44 AM
Why do wolves live in groups? Why do we live in groups? Why do ants, bees, ............
You couldn't survive entirely on your own in the long term.
Even in today's society we sometimes feel we are surviving on our own, but we're not. We're living in a group society. Do you go to the doctor, use roads that are paid for and built by a group, do you purchase groceries of any sort???, etc. etc. That's group living!
As far as hunting in a group. As long as Dick Cheny ain't your hunting partner you'll be fine.
:toomany:
BENESSE
10-27-2009, 01:55 PM
Even in today's society we sometimes feel we are surviving on our own, but we're not. :
To take it a step further, we hardly even think on our own--hence the herd mentality.
crashdive123
10-27-2009, 02:57 PM
To take it a step further, we hardly even think on our own--hence the herd mentality.
Yeah --- what she said --- moo.
2dumb2kwit
10-27-2009, 03:05 PM
To take it a step further, we hardly even think on our own--hence the herd mentality.
Yeah....people just acting on what they herd! *Snort, Chuckle*
Old GI
10-27-2009, 04:20 PM
That's why in some places in the US, Dog hunting Deer is allowed(Vegetation so thick you couldn't see it walking just a few yards away)they(Dogs) make the "Drive" and hunters are prepositioned along the expected route. It can be very effective if done right. Stand hunting in those same areas is VERY "iffy" at best,assuming you have done all your preseason scouting,etc. Stalking in these areas.... You had best be better than the Apaches were at disappearing,more silent than wind on an owls wings,as odorless as pure Mountain air. Otherwise you are just out walking in the woods....with a gun.
Yeah I see where hunting in a group,and working a drive is better than hunting alone... A lot better. Better to have a little deer meat than an empty belly, or a rabbit, or coon or whatever.
My father was disabled (MS) and hunted with a gun club in South Jersey. The topography is so swampy, they used the driver and stander technique quite effectively. The standers were normally older, more experienced shooters. BUT, they all shared the venison.
Winnie
10-27-2009, 06:26 PM
Yeah....people just acting on what they herd! *Snort, Chuckle*
Oh that one hurt!!
Huntinfool
11-06-2009, 11:49 AM
You guys are crazy it's almost like you got MAD COW disease! :tabletalk: :)
~HF~
Not Winnie. I'll bet the best she can muster is Somewhat Perturbed Cow Disease. I'm not sure she would actually get mad.
Winnie
11-06-2009, 04:12 PM
No Rick, I don't get mad, I get even. I find it far more therapeutic:sneaky2:
crashdive123
11-06-2009, 08:12 PM
:sneaky2:Winnie - Not getting mad is good. Getting even???? I prefer to get ahead.:sneaky2:
But where do you keep all the heads? Personally, I'm running out of room.
crashdive123
11-06-2009, 09:17 PM
There's a joke in there, but with our PG-13 format, I'll let it pass.........just sayin.
The case is almost full.
http://images.tabulas.com/6902/l/faces.jpg
Huntinfool
11-06-2009, 10:41 PM
MAD COW I'm tellin' ya MAD COW!! :tongue_smilie:
~hf~
Winnie
11-07-2009, 06:46 AM
Wow! That's a lot of Peter Sellers'!
Huntinfool
11-07-2009, 08:43 AM
Not sure Winnie but I believe that's Elvis Costello???
~HF~
Winnie
11-07-2009, 09:07 AM
No defo Peter Sellers, Elvis Costello doesn't smoke!
oldsoldier
11-07-2009, 07:38 PM
Sounds kinda like the buffalo drives the Indians done a century or so ago. I guess that the simplest ways work and don't need changing.
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