Government's Ability to Respond

[Rick]

I read a lot of posts about the government's ability or lack of ability to respond should some disaster happen. On the surface, we all realize that it's our own responsibility to protect ourselves and our families. But did you know that, by design, the federal government is one of the last entities to assist? I don't think many folks realize that.

The Major Disaster Process

A Major Disaster Declaration usually follows these steps:


Local Government Responds, supplemented by neighboring communities and volunteer agencies. If overwhelmed, turn to the state for assistance;
The State Responds with state resources, such as the National Guard and state agencies;
Damage Assessment by local, state, federal, and volunteer organizations determines losses and recovery needs;
A Major Disaster Declaration is requested by the governor, based on the damage assessment, and an agreement to commit state funds and resources to the long-term recovery;
FEMA Evaluates the request and recommends action to the White House based on the disaster, the local community and the state's ability to recover;
The President approves the request or FEMA informs the governor it has been denied. This decision process could take a few hours or several weeks depending on the nature of the disaster.

I just thought you might want to know.

Source: http://www.fema.gov/hazard/dproc.shtm

[SARKY]

So the question then becomes, Why are so many people waiting for the last two to get involved?

[Rick]

I get the feeling that folks have some misplaced expectation that the roll of HS/FEMA is to be Johny on the spot if something happens. When in fact they can't act until the governor of the state requests it (excluding acts of war/terrorism of course). Little wonder that it sometimes takes days for help to arrive.

I just find it odd that the very folks that don't want the federal government to meddle in their affairs are the same folks that want the feds to land the helicopter and pluck them to safety.

In any case, I thought it noteworthy and might clear up some misconceptions about the various agencies roles.

[COWBOYSURVIVAL]

I get the feeling that folks have some misplaced expectation that the roll of HS/FEMA is to be Johny on the spot if something happens. When in fact they can't act until the governor of the state requests it (excluding acts of war/terrorism of course). Little wonder that it sometimes takes days for help to arrive.

I just find it odd that the very folks that don't want the federal government to meddle in their affairs are the same folks that want the feds to land the helicopter and pluck them to safety.

In any case, I thought it noteworthy and might clear up some misconceptions about the various agencies roles.

Great Post! It is why we need to be self sufficient or more or less prepared...

[Pal334]

This is a good reminder. Evidenced by the state and local governments incompetence during Katrina. The federal government literaly had to hold their hands to write the request for assistance. We should all be prepared to care for ourselves for 3-5 or more days while the assistance chain unravels and gets into action.
Remember these elected officials are the same ones who can not competently manage budgets, so do not pin your hopes that they will act in a competent manner during an emergency.

[peter nap]

It's always been my experience that the Government always gets in the way. Best to avoid and ignore them even if they respond.

When Isabelle came through, my wife and I (We're storm spotter for The National Weather Service) went to the beach and let it pass over us, then followed it inland.

While most people were in a panic and the Government really did get in the way, we were enjoying it.

At home, we had plenty of food, water and enough generation to run life as normal. Even the hospital in the area was blacked out because their emergency generator wouldn't work.

After a couple of days, I took the chainsaw and helped remove trees from peoples homes. Got enough Walnut and maple for Gunstocks, a new dining room table and enough pine to build a new workshop.

The entire time, the ONLY thing I saw the government doing, was putting condemned stickers on houses...and getting in the way. That seems to be what they do best.

[Rick]

Perhaps it's even more basic than that. I'll give you a scenario. You are the mayor or Survivorville. It's a small town of 7000 hard working folks surrounded by family owned farms. It's 2:00 a.m. local time and a 1.5 mile wide F4 tornado just laid down a 3 mile long path of destruction. You lost half the roof on your house. A tree in the front yard landed on your brand new Ford F150 and from what you can tell, in the darkness, there is only piles of debris to the northeast of you.

Your son and his family live 4 blocks to the northeast so his house had to be hit. The small hospital is about 1 mile to the northeast in the middle of town along with city hall and the community building housing the police and fire departments.

You're standing amid the debris in your front yard, flashlight in hand, dressed in pajamas wondering what the h**l just happened. How long do you think it will be before you even think about contacting the governor for help?

[peter nap]

I guess it's an individual thing Rick, but the thought of contacting the Governor or anyone else, wouldn't ever cross my mind. I have insurance so that can be worked out later.

I have tarps and lumber and even my own sawmill, so I can get the house water tight quickly.

I have a truck, three motorcycles (Dirt bikes) a kayak, canoe and a sailboat, and a mountain bike...so I can get to the kids quickly.

I have generation and enough food and water for us, the kids and grandchildren for 6 months or so and the farm is off grid and it's better stocked, if we run low in the burbs.
If the cell phones go out I have Hand held Marine radios and 2 meter as well as a base CB.

To complete the package, I have plenty of DVD's and popcorn

The Governor can go to He!!.

[Rick]

But you are the governor of Survivorville. It's your responsibility!! It's just like you politicians to only worry about your own A$$ and leave the rest of us to figure it out on our own. By the way, didn't you read. Half the farm is gone now. Your popcorn and DVDs are scattered in the next county. Tarps and wood? Not anymore and that big ole oak landed on the sawmill. (sorry) Good luck!

[2dumb2kwit]

I guess it's an individual thing Rick, but the thought of contacting the Governor or anyone else, wouldn't ever cross my mind. I have insurance so that can be worked out later.

I have tarps and lumber and even my own sawmill, so I can get the house water tight quickly.

I have a truck, three motorcycles (Dirt bikes) a kayak, canoe and a sailboat, and a mountain bike...so I can get to the kids quickly.

I have generation and enough food and water for us, the kids and grandchildren for 6 months or so and the farm is off grid and it's better stocked, if we run low in the burbs.
If the cell phones go out I have Hand held Marine radios and 2 meter as well as a base CB.

To complete the package, I have plenty of DVD's and popcorn

The Governor can go to He!!.

Popcorn! Huh...if things get bad, I'm going to your place. It's closer than Kens place! LOL:innocent:

[peter nap]

Popcorn! Huh...if things get bad, I'm going to your place. It's closer than Kens place! LOL:innocent:

Popcorn is very important when you watch the natives.

http://photos.oldva.org/albums/userpics/tax_this3small.jpg

[oldsoldier]

Perhaps it's even more basic than that. I'll give you a scenario. You are the mayor or Survivorville. It's a small town of 7000 hard working folks surrounded by family owned farms. It's 2:00 a.m. local time and a 1.5 mile wide F4 tornado just laid down a 3 mile long path of destruction. You lost half the roof on your house. A tree in the front yard landed on your brand new Ford F150 and from what you can tell, in the darkness, there is only piles of debris to the northeast of you.

Your son and his family live 4 blocks to the northeast so his house had to be hit. The small hospital is about 1 mile to the northeast in the middle of town along with city hall and the community building housing the police and fire departments.

You're standing amid the debris in your front yard, flashlight in hand, dressed in pajamas wondering what the h**l just happened. How long do you think it will be before you even think about contacting the governor for help?

Rick That's plagerizim I tell Ya!!! What did you do hack my computer????:innocent:No actualy I am trying to put together a booklet for our local EMA to publish for our community and your scenerio is really close to mine.
My recommendations are 1. If you are not in imminent danger i.e fire, explosion STAY PUT!! you may be in more danger by trying to get out at the moment. 2. Take stock of your situation. Make sure you and your family are not injured. If you are prepared you have a checklist (mental) of what to do. If your home has gas turn off the gas, Then turn off other utilites water at meter if you can, Turn off the electricity at the breaker box if you can safely do so. try to assess the safety of your home. If you have only "last part of your roof" then you maybe okay to shelter in place the rest of the night. If not hopefully you have a second vehicle that is undamaged and worse case you can spend the remainder of thr night there. Trying to leave at night is a bad Idea unless you have no other option. There will likely be unseen hazards to get around/through you can not see. down powerlines trees etc. WAIT IT OUT. 3. get together some supplies hopefully you have a BOB or emergency "kit" and you can get to it. Once you have gotten dressed and wearing appropriate shoes and clothing and have your family in a "safe" place you may want to check on your friends/neighbors close by. IF there are no serious injuries PLEASE DO NOT try to use the phone In the event of a disaster if the phones both landline and cellular are working they will likely be very busy because of people trying to call for help. The lines will be jammed. If you are going to call use a contact out of your area ( aunt edna in another state) have them be your whole family contact and they can let you know everyone is okay or their status. Don't try to call the police/fire department what ever to see what happened they will be busy with other things.

The main thing to do is TRY not to panic, remaining calm is the number one key to staying safe. Staying put also makes it more likely that you will recieve help soon than you would just wandering around, Espcially if you don't have a plan of evacuation or proper "equipment" to do so.
Some of you may disagree with this or may add to it. If so fine I am no expert and appreciate your comments/input. These are just my humble opinions.

[peter nap]

But you are the governor of Survivorville. It's your responsibility!! It's just like you politicians to only worry about your own A$$ and leave the rest of us to figure it out on our own. By the way, didn't you read. Half the farm is gone now. Your popcorn and DVDs are scattered in the next county. Tarps and wood? Not anymore and that big ole oak landed on the sawmill. (sorry) Good luck!

Now that's different!

In that case I'd have to dig up one of my buried gun and go take someone else s popcorn:clap:

How big was that tornado anyway...my farm is 100 miles from my burb house.

[Rick]

All good points, OS.

My intent is for folks to rationalize for just a moment. Whether it is a mayor, city council member or city department head, we're talking about people that will be impacted just like you. I think it a bit misguided to expect them to grasp the extent of the situation and implement emergency plans within a few hours. They might not even know how to do it and might not have a plan in place. These folks, after all, are your neighbors. Do they LOOK prepared?

At the state level, I expect implementation to improve drastically. The states should all have plans in place and have practiced them to some degree. I can forgive my mayor where I will be more critical of my governor. Still, expecting them to respond inside of several days might put me on the wrong side of planning. Just my thoughts.

[peter nap]

All good points, OS.

My intent is for folks to rationalize for just a moment. Whether it is a mayor, city council member or city department head, we're talking about people that will be impacted just like you. I think it a bit misguided to expect them to grasp the extent of the situation and implement emergency plans within a few hours. They might not even know how to do it and might not have a plan in place. These folks, after all, are your neighbors. Do they LOOK prepared?

At the state level, I expect implementation to improve drastically. The states should all have plans in place and have practiced them to some degree. I can forgive my mayor where I will be more critical of my governor. Still, expecting them to respond inside of several days might put me on the wrong side of planning. Just my thoughts.

It's actually a very good point Rick and your logic is sound.
I jut don't like depending on anyone.

Back in the 80's I worked for the SCC in the utility regulatory division. We had a huge snow/ice storm. Power was out everywhere.

After 3 weeks one of the Commissioners asked me if there was any way I could ask (Force ) the power company to fast track his power restoration.

So much for state emergency management.

And yes, I did make them run right over and fix him up. I'm mean, but not stupid.

[Rick]

That's pretty common from a utility perspective. Emergency services, local officials (to manage the disaster) and then friends and family. :innocent:

[pocomoonskyeyes]

THANK YOU RICK!!!! You just made my signature that much more meaningful!! WooHoo!! I understand EXACTLY where you are coming from. NEVER DEPEND ON ANYTHING except on what you know, in your own mind. If a Tornado rips everything, and I mean EVERYTHING, from your grasp that you have, ALL your possessions,what are you left with? You have just been, for all intents and purposes,plunged into the stone age. No BOB,no tools,no gooberment,no community(at least for the moment) NOTHING!!
Ask the citizens of Greensburg Kansas what it was like.Leveled flat,only tools were what they could find or make, at least for a while.
As to anyone saying that they would ask no one for help, well think that if you want. Even a Drowning man will reach out for help, even if the only people around are his enemies. It's Nature,and not just Human nature either, all living things want to survive even if just for another day.
This is something you really need to give some SERIOUS thought to. Home - gone. Transportation - gone. All possessions - gone. What do you do NEXT?

[Chris]

I get the feeling that folks have some misplaced expectation that the roll of HS/FEMA is to be Johny on the spot if something happens. When in fact they can't act until the governor of the state requests it (excluding acts of war/terrorism of course). Little wonder that it sometimes takes days for help to arrive.

I just find it odd that the very folks that don't want the federal government to meddle in their affairs are the same folks that want the feds to land the helicopter and pluck them to safety.

In any case, I thought it noteworthy and might clear up some misconceptions about the various agencies roles.
No kidding.

I actually got a letter to the editor published (in Playboy, harharhar). Over this.

It was after Katrina and they published some diatribe by some yahoo about how Bush was trying to take over the country and grab power because he was supporting a bill that would give the federal government power to call out state national guards to respond to domestic issues. I sent a letter pointing out how hypocritical it was of them to complain about the federal government's lack of response to Katrina when it wasn't their JOB to be the first responders, and then to simultaneously complain when the federal government tries to make it their job for a future disaster.

Personally I was against the bill because I'm in favor of State's rights, but I also never blamed the federal government for Katrina because I knew the chain of command in those situations meant that the local and state government were supposed to handle the initial response (and as I recall, they even were asked by the Feds to evacuate a day before and refused).

To blame the feds for inaction when the law did not give them the power to act faster, and then to attack them when they tried to gain the power to act in the future, was the definition of hypocritical.

[2dumb2kwit]

But the Gubment funds groups that can help folks.:innocent:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,549241,00.html

[Ole WV Coot]

I am basically a coward, therefore I look out for #1 and family. I never expect help but glad to get it. I don't think the government could find me unless I owed them money. My neighbors do work well as a team without a designated leader in the floods we are always having in this area.

[FVR]

I don't expect the gov. to come to my aide. I can take care of things here. I live on a nice hill so there will be no flooding. If the house goes, if we survive then we hit the hotel and contact USAA.

There are reasons why I don't live on the coast or live in tornado alley. The same reasons why I don't reside in Cal., with the earthquakes or states with volcanoes.

Now, I would not mind living in the Outer Banks. I would be prepared and if a major storm was coming.........then I would get the hell out of Dodge. Common sense.

Katrina, the smart ones left. I have friends, college edumacated who decided to stay. The second day when the water was pushing them to their second floor, they decided to load up one of there bayou boats and hit the water. He, his wife, some important things and his (loaded) shotgun.

He later told me that they should have listened and left when it was suggested.

[FVR]

A Good thread would be, if you were told about a severe storm and it was suggest that you leave, would you go? If not, why? If you would leave, what would you take?

[Winnie]

As there are no individual states over here, the govt controls emergency plans direct and the orders filter down to county level. On the whole the response is OK. However, I'm not one to wait for help, I can now help myself (thanks to you peeps). I see no point in sitting on your backside waiting for help when a bit of planning could perhaps keep you safe.

[Chris]

A Good thread would be, if you were told about a severe storm and it was suggest that you leave, would you go? If not, why? If you would leave, what would you take?
It is hard for me to fathom that because I can never see myself in such a situation.

Like you, I purposefully will not live in a risky area, or if I did, I would prepare prior to a disaster.

For instance, Florida... step 1, build high to avoid flooding, possibly even making floor 1 just your garage, and living on floors 2 and 3.

Step 2, build a concrete home. It is possible to build a hurricane proof home out of concrete, people do it all the time.

Step 3, shutters, so you don't have to nail up so much plywood.

Don't build your home below sea level on the coast (New Orleans), build on highground, and if there is a risk of high winds, build with concrete.

IF you live in an area prone to wildfires. Put on a metal roof, do not use flammable siding (and again, concrete walls would help) Keep your landscape well irrigated, and remove any brush or trees near your home.

Volcanoes are best avoided.

[finallyME]

My house is 5000 ft surrounded by the Rocky Mountains. Is that considered high ground?