Alaska/Canadian Wilderness

[Philip]

Hi everybody. I'm new here but I was recently contemplating about moving into the wilderness. I really like cold weather and snow so northern Alaska or Canada (maybe Yukon Territory) seem like good options for me. I'm not sure about the laws of homesteading in these regions and have found contradictory answers on the Internet. Also if I am forced to buy a property I probably won't be able to pay for taxes if there are any.
Also I have always wanted to become a trapper/hunter so I assume I could make some money that way for supplies like beans and rice and such. I don't know where to start with my dream though. What should I buy what shouldn't I do (rookie mistakes) and what regions could I possibly live in. I would really like to hear from people with cold weather and snow experience but I'm sure everybody on the website has great advice and experience. Thanks!

[Philip]

Also what supplies are needed to get started (including food) and any recommended guns and traps. If anyone knows the gun and hunting laws/ permits in these regions that would be great!
If anyone knows anything about selling hides that would be helpful too!
Sorry for all the questions. I'm just really excited about the idea of living in the wilderness!

[Sarge47]

Sourdough not only lives there but has been involved as a realtor. There are other members here that live in Alaska as well. As far as homesteading there goes, I think that door's closed but will wait for SD, Winter, and othrs to respond. :detective:

[BENESSE]

To help with advice, why not tell us a bit about yourself. Age, experience (even if none), the region where you live, etc.

[hunter63]

Have you ever done any hunting, trapping?....or even camping, building.....?.
What you suggest is going to be difficult even for a experienced person....

So as we have no idea of details about you, here is a good starting point....
http://www.wilderness-survival.net/forums/showthread.php?8786-Wilderness-Living-Dreams-or-Delusions


And he is the story of an experienced guy.....
http://www.wilderness-survival.net/forums/showthread.php?20774-Does-the-forum-know-missing-quot-Survivalist-quot

[1stimestar]

There is property you can buy here that does not have any property taxes. Of course, you'll have no services either such as roads. The homestead act is gone so you can't do that now. How will you run a trap line? With dogs or snow machine? Do you have any mushing experience or know how to repair a snow machine? They are very high maintenance vehicles. Non residence can not hunt big game without a licensed guide. How will you build a shelter? How will you keep from freezing to death? Chopping enough wood to survive a winter will take all your summer. Chain saws require fuel. How will you afford that? How will you GET that?

[Philip]

Ok. I have no experience. I'm twenty and I'm currently living on Long Island. I really do want to try to make it though. I can imagine it'll be a tough experience but a rewarding one as well.

[hunter63]

So just what do you think would be your first step? besides asking questions on the interweb?

Maybe start with what you do know?

Do you know how to clean/cook a game animal?...what game animals?
What are you gonna trap?....
Shot a gun?...or bow, cut fire wood, made a fire?

Ya gotta start somewhere.

[Sourdough]

All you need is money. Study others who have the same dream.............( My forum name on the "Alaska Outdoors Forum" is AGL4now )

http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/showthread.php/122615-Would-like-to-go-off-grid-in-Alaska

http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/showthread.php/124208-New-member-Just-starting-my-research

http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/forumdisplay.php/82-Relocating-to-Alaska

This is a good read also.........http://www.wilderness-survival.net/forums/showthread.php?8786-Wilderness-Living-Dreams-or-Delusions&highlight=Cost+Alaska

[BENESSE]

Ok. I have no experience. I'm twenty and I'm currently living on Long Island. I really do want to try to make it though. I can imagine it'll be a tough experience but a rewarding one as well.

Why not start by looking for a job, any physical outdoorsy job in Alaska, where you can learn valuable skills and make a bit of money? At your age you won't need much in terms of comfort and you'll be starting at the bottom so it won't be hard to land something somewhere. If you're willing to tough it out for minimal pay, you won't have much competition either.
Remember, your objective is to learn and experience first hand what life would be like at a place you're interested in.

[Winter]

I'd suggest moving close to a wilderness area. Work a regular job, get to know the locals, and hunt, fish, and trap in your spare time.

Here, for instance, alot of people hunt, trap and subsistence fish while living in town and holding down a regular job. Everything is a boat ride away.

I'd consider it foolish to just jump into buying a remote piece of property and expect to survive off the land with no experience.

Learn the skills first.

[Sarge47]

You're probably thinking that we're all being a bit on the negative side, but we do advise caution for a very good reason. This article is about somebody with the same dream as yours who was also a bit more experienced:

http://www.adn.com/2012/11/17/2696373/wisconsin-survivalist-missing.html :mellow:

[Power Giant]

Ok. I have no experience. I'm twenty and I'm currently living on Long Island. I really do want to try to make it though. I can imagine it'll be a tough experience but a rewarding one as well.

I was born and raised on Long Island. Left there in '76 and never looked back. You need to do some extended backpacking in the Catskill mts and the Adirondack mts. They are in your state. You can take the bus there if you don't own a vehicle. This would be a practical way to see if this is what you want to do.

[ElevenBravo]

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0758758/

At least watch the movie before you go, its a true life story. Alaska is unforgiving. Young man had great intentions, but no experience.

Like they say, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

[Philip]

I understand that I need information and I still have some important questions. How much do traps cost in general? How many will I need to do that I have enough skins to sell? Do most small towns even buy skins? How much money will I need to start (I don't need plumbing or electricity or roads) what supplies would i need to live year round? Can I sell skins or meat or both? Do I really need anything gas powered(I would rather not because gas will be hard to transport) and which location in Alaska/Canada is is safe to go to(I need at least four hours of sunlight)

[BENESSE]

Philip, why don't you at least spend some time perusing the links Sourdough has provided in post #9, and other suggested links?
(If you didn't get the drift so far, most who answered think you're putting the cart before the horse.)

[Philip]

Sorry. I get ahead of myself a lot.

[Sourdough]

I understand that I need information and I still have some important questions. How much do traps cost in general? How many will I need to do that I have enough skins to sell? Do most small towns even buy skins? How much money will I need to start (I don't need plumbing or electricity or roads) what supplies would i need to live year round? Can I sell skins or meat or both? Do I really need anything gas powered(I would rather not because gas will be hard to transport) and which location in Alaska/Canada is is safe to go to(I need at least four hours of sunlight)

http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/forumdisplay.php/35-Alaska-Trapping-and-Predator-Hunting

If you start with about $200,000.00 after about two years of very hard work, and if you are lucky, you should be able to leave Alaska with "BUS" fare, the rest will be gone.

[Philip]

http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/forumdisplay.php/35-Alaska-Trapping-and-Predator-Hunting

If you start with about $200,000.00 after about two years of very hard work, and if you are lucky, you should be able to leave Alaska with "BUS" fare, the rest will be gone.

If it costs that much money how is it even possible to get started?

[ElevenBravo]

Or, just live in a bus for free! I have doubts on the insulation though....
8553

[1stimestar]

We are actually having a pretty mild winter so far. Normally by now we would have had several days of -30 and -40F temperatures, not windchill.

Tuesday
Overcast. Fog early. High of 1F with a windchill as low as -31F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Tuesday Night
Overcast with snow showers. Fog overnight. Low of -22F. Winds from the NNE at 5 to 10 mph.

Wednesday
Overcast with snow showers. Fog early. High of -15F. Winds less than 5 mph.

Wednesday Night
Mostly cloudy. Low of -26F with a windchill as low as -42F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Thursday
Partly cloudy. High of -9F with a windchill as low as -36F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Thursday Night
Clear. Low of -20F with a windchill as low as -29F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Friday
Clear. High of -6F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Friday Night
Clear. Low of -13F with a windchill as low as -26F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Saturday
Clear. High of -6F with a windchill as low as -26F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Saturday Night
Clear. Fog overnight. Low of -9F. Winds from the ENE at 5 to 10 mph.

Sunday
Clear. Fog early. High of -4F. Winds less than 5 mph.

Sunday Night
Partly cloudy. Low of -13F. Winds less than 5 mph.

Monday
Partly cloudy. High of -6F. Winds less than 5 mph.

Monday Night
Clear. Low of -8F. Winds less than 5 mph.

Tuesday
Clear. High of -6F. Winds less than 5 mph.

Tuesday Night
Clear. Low of -9F with a windchill as low as -20F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Wednesday
Clear. High of -6F with a windchill as low as -22F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Wednesday Night
Clear. Low of -15F with a windchill as low as -26F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Thursday
Clear. High of -11F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Thursday Night
Clear. Low of -15F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

Friday
Clear. High of -11F. Winds less than 5 mph.

Friday Night
Clear. Low of -15F with a windchill as low as -26F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.

[hunter63]

Not much for insulation in a old bus.... but a wood stove made from an oil drum with the stove pipe out the window, has been done, by a guy just down the road.....

Seriously Philip, you really need to think this through....How are you gonna make a living trapping if you have no clue of even what to trap a how.

In the past the people on this forum have been accused of being hard on new members, for asking questions like what kind of knife, or in your case, how many traps?.... but the reasoning was to not have to read about you in the paper as a casuality 6 months from now.

Follow the advice, get into the wild slowly and gather knowlage, have a plan, or get a job in the area....and as has been brought......plenty of money.

Just asking questions with out any real information on the web isn't the best approach.

If I were to start a post that said, "I want to go to Mars, what do in need?....How do you think that would go?

[Philip]

I get I came off as very rash and I do need experience and the comments all of you have me helped me understand better of what I truly need first: experience and basic knowledge. I'll probably go to Alaska and work there for a while and talk to the locals, go hunting, and learn. Thanks.

[1stimestar]

https://alexsys.labor.state.ak.us/

http://newsminer.com/

http://cooljobs.com/

Find summer employment (easy to do in the tourist area), come up and learn.

[hunter63]

Good for you, might want to do some rearch into "where", as a start?

[Philip]

I was looking around and thinking fairbanks. I'm not sure of anything yet. It'll be at least a year or two until I'm positive what I want to do

[1stimestar]

Fairbanks is "the real Alaska". Anchorage, well, you might as well go to Seatlle.... Believe me, if you want to learn about trapping here, and living off the land as much as possible, this is the place to do so. But don't come up without enough money to get out if it doesn't work out for you. You do not want to be homeless here!

[Sourdough]

Philip, The single greatest skill needed, is the ability to disassemble things, and jerry'rig a fix. Example: Taking a chainsaw apart, not just the chain loop and bar. Fixing your traps, clothing, fixing your firearm, fixing your sled, etc.
http://www.wilderness-survival.net/forums/entry.php?405-quot-I-ran-away-to-off-grid-Wilderness-amp-LIVED-quot

[Winter]

If you are close to the ocean, there's alot of food to be had.

[Williepete]

Philip, I know some will shoot me down on this, but for you to get an idea of just what its like up there, start watching the series on the Discovery channel, "Alaska, the last Fronteri. If you watch it closely you will see just how much food, wood and other things that are needed to survive there.

Bill

[BornthatWay]

Philip, these folks have given you very sound advice. You must learn the basics of survival and camping before you take on this ambitious idea. No one wants you to go out and get hurt or killed and that can easily happen.

I know when you are 20 and wanting to be on your own you feel that nothing bad will happen and you are invincible but mother nature does not hold your hand and help you if youy get into trouble she just lets it happen as it will. For instance if you are trapping along a rriver and get caught in a trap and are soaking wet at -20 she is not going to get you out of the trap build you a fire and hug you to help you get warm. Nature will just take its course and unless you have the knowledge and experience of what to do it would be the end of Philip and none of us want to see that happen.

So get out in an area and practice practice practice the skills you need to know. After you have the skill practice them in all different types of weather because the weather is not always bright sunny and warm.

And remember to ask questions about anything that puzzles you or you feel you need advice on after doing some research on your own. For example the question about the cost of traps could be found by googling hunting traps and digging for the answer. If tou had said I have found the price of traps to be xxx.xx does this seem about right for the traooing I am interested in would show that you have at least tried to find the answer. If you want to live the lifestyle youy say you do then you must learn to try to seek the answer on your own as in this lifestyle it will often be that only you will be in these places alone toi figure out many things.

It appears you have a good head on your shoulders as tou have realized in this one thread that there is so much you need to learn before striking out on your destiny. So keep the questions coming whenecer you feel that you need some help.

[ElevenBravo]

Good job Phillip... I too read about the "Alaskan Dream" in this thread. I must admit, I never realized the obstetricals that must be overcome just for a simple dream! I like to think Im pretty handy out of doors, but I no where ready for Alaska. I think the suggestion of moving there and working while learning from the locals is the best, most sound advice Ive ever heard.

One day, maybe I too will make the trek!

[ElevenBravo]

BTW..

http://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/sportsmans/Stoney-Wolf-Productions:-Wilderness-Trapping-DVD/productDetail/Other-DVD/prod999901359294/cat100499

[hunter63]

Don't be in a rush....It has taken me 65 years to find out what I don't know.........

[kyratshooter]

You guys all know Darwin was right!

Why are we trying to interfere with natural selection?

I think he should pack up his Bug Out Bag and leave for the wilderness tomorrow.

Good luck with that!

[hunter63]

911 ruined Darwin theory of natural selection........Wasn't us.

[Power Giant]

This thread really hits home for me. My wife and I, and 2 young kids struck out for Alaska in '92 to live the dream. We traveled around for awhile and ended up in the Southeast. I bought a small chunk of land on the water and built a small cabin. We did this for four years and ended up coming back the lower 48. Why, you ask? Here is what we found out: Alaska is cold and dark in the winter. Oh, and did I mention cold and dark? In winter the sun didn't hit the cabin for about 3-4 months. Get the picture? The Southeast has a plentiful food supply. I am sick of eating salmon to this day (not really). It rains ALOT there. Ketchikan gets about 125 inches per year of the stuff. Juneau gets about 90 inches. Yakutat gets 225 inches per year. You better not mind the rain in the Southeast. On the bright side, there is plenty of water. I found that it is expensive to live there. And no offense to any Alaskans when I say this, but we didn't care for the people there too much. Sorry. But, that is why there are so few people living there, I suppose. As one Sourdough told me, "I don't know why folks think that there is so much game up here. The fact is, the further north you travel, the less game there is."

[1stimestar]

This thread really hits home for me. My wife and I, and 2 young kids struck out for Alaska in '92 to live the dream. We traveled around for awhile and ended up in the Southeast. I bought a small chunk of land on the water and built a small cabin. We did this for four years and ended up coming back the lower 48. Why, you ask? Here is what we found out: Alaska is cold and dark in the winter. Oh, and did I mention cold and dark? In winter the sun didn't hit the cabin for about 3-4 months. Get the picture? The Southeast has a plentiful food supply. I am sick of eating salmon to this day (not really). It rains ALOT there. Ketchikan gets about 125 inches per year of the stuff. Juneau gets about 90 inches. Yakutat gets 225 inches per year. You better not mind the rain in the Southeast. On the bright side, there is plenty of water. I found that it is expensive to live there. And no offense to any Alaskans when I say this, but we didn't care for the people there too much. Sorry. But, that is why there are so few people living there, I suppose. As one Sourdough told me, "I don't know why folks think that there is so much game up here. The fact is, the further north you travel, the less game there is."

Yep, that is some of the reality of Alaska. Having the sea to eat from also means enough rain to wash nutrients from the soil, making gardening difficult. Moving north, such as where I am near Fairbanks, means arctic desert. So no rain, but a realllly short growing season, less daylight in the winter and colder temperatures in the winter, permafrost and muskeg. But, the people in Fairbanks are different. We have a very small town, friendly feeling. Mostly because sooner or later, everyone needs a neighbors help. You better be on good terms with your neighbors if your car wont start, your heat goes out, you slide off in a ditch, you get snowed or iced in, etc. Also, it's a love it or hate it type of place. It's too extreme for people who do not love it. Those people leave. So most everyone here is here because they want to be. That makes for happy, adventurous people.

[Winter]

This thread really hits home for me. My wife and I, and 2 young kids struck out for Alaska in '92 to live the dream. We traveled around for awhile and ended up in the Southeast. I bought a small chunk of land on the water and built a small cabin. We did this for four years and ended up coming back the lower 48. Why, you ask? Here is what we found out: Alaska is cold and dark in the winter. Oh, and did I mention cold and dark? In winter the sun didn't hit the cabin for about 3-4 months. Get the picture? The Southeast has a plentiful food supply. I am sick of eating salmon to this day (not really). It rains ALOT there. Ketchikan gets about 125 inches per year of the stuff. Juneau gets about 90 inches. Yakutat gets 225 inches per year. You better not mind the rain in the Southeast. On the bright side, there is plenty of water. I found that it is expensive to live there. And no offense to any Alaskans when I say this, but we didn't care for the people there too much. Sorry. But, that is why there are so few people living there, I suppose. As one Sourdough told me, "I don't know why folks think that there is so much game up here. The fact is, the further north you travel, the less game there is."

I'm a Ketchikanite. Alot of buttholes live here. Most are fresh from the lower 48.

[1stimestar]

Lol yep. Or maybe I should say "no comment".

[Power Giant]

I'm a Ketchikanite. Alot of buttholes live here. Most are fresh from the lower 48.

Like I said, no offense intended, sorry if I rattled your cage with the comment that we didn't care for the folks in AK. The fact is I'm not the gregarious type and don't care for most people in general, so it's mostly my fault.

[BENESSE]

Also, it's a love it or hate it type of place. It's too extreme for people who do not love it. Those people leave. So most everyone here is here because they want to be. That makes for happy, adventurous people.

That's exactly how I'd describe some of us who'd stuck it out in Manhattan for as long a we have. (23yrs--the longest we'd lived anywhere)
We'll occasionally admit to a love/hate relationship but something happens when we come back home across the bridge from LGA or JFK and Manhattan skyline comes into view and we feel this is where it's at.
Yeah, we look at the centerfolds of other locations, we read about the cheap real estate and the low cost of living elsewhere, we fantasize about having WSF members for neighbors and then then we walk out our front door and realize we're at the center of the universe. Where do you go from there?

[1stimestar]

That's exactly how I'd describe some of us who'd stuck it out in Manhattan for as long a we have. (23yrs--the longest we'd lived anywhere)
We'll occasionally admit to a love/hate relationship but something happens when we come back home across the bridge from LGA or JFK and Manhattan skyline comes into view and we feel this is where it's at.
Yeah, we look at the centerfolds of other locations, we read about the cheap real estate and the low cost of living elsewhere, we fantasize about having WSF members for neighbors and then then we walk out our front door and realize we're at the center of the universe. Where do you go from there?

Yes! People in Texas and Louisiana seem to have similar love and pride in their location.

[Winter]

Like I said, no offense intended, sorry if I rattled your cage with the comment that we didn't care for the folks in AK. The fact is I'm not the gregarious type and don't care for most people in general, so it's mostly my fault.

Nah man, I'm not angry. What happens is people come up and then whine constantly about the weather and price of goods. I tell them where the airport and/or ferry is.

The worst kind of cheechako's are the ones from cities who come up here and instantly get into politics in an attempt to make AK into Washington or California.

[hunter63]

We get them out here in the boonies of Wisconsin, city people trying to make the country into what the left...street lights, speed limits,(our curvey, speed signs are a dare ard they have horses)....... and would put stockade fences around their property is they could afford it.....LOL

Oh yeah and call the sheriff if they hear a shot....Makes it fun when playing "roll the 1 pound propane canister down the hill with the .357"

Same most every where......

[crashdive123]

People move to X for whatever reason and want to it like they were used to. I always wondered why they moved if that's how they feel. Yep. Happens everywhere.

[Winter]

Another example of people scared of change I reckon.

When I first got up here in 89' or so, I called the cops on a guy with a truckload of dead seals. Let's just say that slowed down the friend making process quite a bit.

I was ignorant of the law and brainwashed to consider seal hunting an evil thing done by maniacal corporations to make the obscenely rich some fur coats.

[1stimestar]

Hhahah. Sorry Winter, had to laugh at that one. I do imagine the first time you see that would be a shocker.