The best type of Survival show!

[Sarge47]

Hokay! I don't give a fat rat's hind parts if you are a fan of Grylli Vanilli, Les Stroud, Roy Mears, or whoever, the way I see it, the problem with these Survival shows are the slick way in which they're made. Les camps out while Bear runs through the woods like a demented Tarzan. Mr. Mears I haven't seen so I reserve judgement. However how real is it? The reason I liked Discovery's "Marine Corps Survival School" was because it was the real deal. Military personel from different branches either volunteered, or were volunteered to attend. They were taken up into the mountains by their instructors and put through their paces. They each were given a half-day's ration (a cold-weather MRE) and a live rabbit that they had to kill, clean, skin, and eat everything on it that was edible; eyes, bones, etc. It was winter with snow up in the mountains and they were 1st taught the basics on making a fire using a fire-bow that they had to make themselves, then make a fire by using it. As they hiked up the mountains, it got more & more harder. Finally, after they had passed their tests, like spending a night solo out in the wilds, they were herded back into the vehicles and were going back to base.....or so they thought. Picture this! You think it's all over. It's been tough but you've done it; passed everything, now you're headed back to a nice hot bath and a cold beer. You're laughing it up with your buddies when BOOM!!! The vehicles slam to a stop, the back door flies open and your instructors are yelling at you to get out of the vehicles. As you try to collect your wits they pull out only four packs for about 20 grunts and say: "This plane has crashed out here in the mountains. These 4 packs are the only equipment you've been able to salvage. There are bandits in the area and you have only one map & compass to find your way back home! One of your people asks: " Is there food & water nearby?" The instructor throws a snowball at you and says: "No food, but there's your water! See you later!" And off they go in the vehicles leaving you all alone to pass your final test that you weren't even prepared for! That's what Survival is all about. It's UNPLANNED!, It's NOT a game! The decisions you have to make can mean life or death for you or one of your comrads. What do you do? How much did you learn? The problem that I see with other Survival shows is that they're all contrived. Major TV Networks will step in if a crisis pops up because they know that ratings will die along with their star if they let anything happen to them. Les tried to fake an arm injury during his "Boreal Forest" episode but had to give it up after a short time. I'd like to see something more along the lines of a real Survival scenario than what we've seen so far. How about you?:confused:

[crashdive123]

Agreed. Problems with the cable shows are many. 1st, the corporate lawyers probably get a big say in what they are allowed to do. 2nd, they want the ratings so often times things are staged, not realizing that true survival would probably rate much higher. 3rd the stars of the shows become celebrities and start to believe their own hype.

[NY MtnMan72]

In defense of Les Stroud...

meh to be honest i could take or leave "survivorman" - its ok, but you know that he has an "out"... either a sat phone or something so if the SHTF, he can punch out..... (i can no longer watch "man -vs- hotel room..err i mean WILD anymore without gettin a sick feeling in my stomach- such a fake)

However- what i do give him(LES) credit for is A) he's actually a heck of a musician- didnt know that til recently, and B) i LOVED the documentary he made called "off the grid" or something like that.
He went, bought 150 acres in northern Ontario somewhere- and the show was about him setting it all up to live off the grid- solar + wind powered electric, rain water reservoirs, etc etc...
You can actually watch it for free on youtube- someone put it up in like 7 or 8 10 min parts....
He was trying to get to a point where he could move with his wife and two very cute kids to his "compound" and live full time. Towards the end of the flick he was very near able to do so.... def worth watchin.

He even mentions that "survivorman" and other projects are just to keep some money coming in so he can set himself up the way he wants....
Seems like a pretty grounded cool kat if you ask me....

A r t

HERES the off the grid episodes....

#1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wg7EaLIJrBw
#2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZCrP2K5IOM&feature=related
#3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elpPtuj4gvI&feature=related
#4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3x479Nochpw&feature=related
#5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTTJa-kccS4&feature=related
#6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OO01Sy1yy4s&feature=related
annd
phew...
#7
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3KrAEvO2VM&feature=related

[bulrush]

Yay Sarge! I saw the Marine Corps one also. It was a good show. Didn't they also have to eat a rabbit eyeball or something as a test of "mind over matter"?

[Rick]

Oh, Lord! A rabbit eyeball? I would mind and it would matter!

[nell67]

Oh, Lord! A rabbit eyeball? I would mind and it would matter!
You can say that again!!:eek:

[Sam]

The rabbit eye has vitamins and 'water' to things you can not afford to waste when you are up against the wall.

[Rick]

Wanna bet? It would be four things 'cause I'd toss both eyes. Unless he was a cyrabbit or a former pirabbit (pirate...pirabbit?) Too good.

[Beo]

Yeah I ain't eating no eyes dude, sorry you can have them. Plenty else to eat.
The best survival show would to be give Les and Bear a small pack with limited items in it and then air drop them into the wilds 500 miles from anything and come get them two weeks later and see if they survived (we could watch it live from the gps satalite tracker shoved up their azzez.... lol... cept it'd be all aerial views... :D

[nell67]

If I am up against the wall,even tied,you would have a fight on your hands to get me to eat a rabbits eye!

[trax]

I'm with the guys doing the surviving on this one. I'd suck the eyes out of a live rabbit if I was hungry enough

[Beo]

gotta one eyed wonder worm here... lol... suck the eye outta that... lol... just joking bro but hadda say it... :D

[nell67]

BEO!!!!!!!!!!!!:eek:

[Beo]

Sorry... lol... couldn't help myself it too easy... :D lol... I was just kidding.

[nell67]

SURE!!!!!!!:o

[trax]

I did say RABBIT there partner.

[Rick]

Ptttooooheee! Spit! Yuck! Are you nuts? Eyeballs have irises and lenses and optic nerves. What if you got a lens stuck in your craw? What then? Or what if it blinked after you ate it?:eek: Lights out! If we ever get lost together you can have the eyes and the azzes. I'll take the meat, buddy.

[Beo]

I'd eat the eyes as a last resort, but I'm thinking after all the meat that the eyes would get tossed, the fur used a TP and then discarded (unless your bear grylls) and I'd get another later or a squirrel, if there's rabbits theres squirrels, if theres squirrels there's nuts (I know whats coming now), more food to eat.

[nell67]

If you know,then I guess,you asked for it???LMAO!!

[trax]

I always tend to relate these what-ifs to the area I grew up in. If I was stuck in an isolated place in the wilderness of northern Manitoba in the wintertime, that's one of the worst case scenarios most people would ever have to face and I'm pretty sure I could handle it better than most. It's nice to say that there's going to be more rabbits, or squirrels or whatever, but you don't know that. You better make the absolute most of what you have in front of you, right now. You also need to know that you have to 'do the math' on the amount of energy expended versus the amount of energy/nutrition received. I'm not talking about some funsies wilderness trek where you can turn around and go get your Mars bar out of the truck.That's survival, that's what Sarge was referring to in the first post, and if you're stuck somewhere you better be prepared to deal with it at that level.

[nell67]

Okay,but I'm not going to chew!

[Beo]

Even if it were one rabbit, in Manitoba in the dead of a harsh winter I would only eat the eyes in an extreme emergency, there are always other things in the wild, even in deeep snow. You living there are better prepared of course but you could find things to eat if had too I know it.

[bulrush]

When I was a kid I knew a guy who loved chicken butts. Each time we had baked chicken he would say "Save the butt for me! I want the butt!" Then he would make gross slurping noises as he ate the butt to freak us kids out. I thought it was hilarious.

[Beo]

That's just nasty... :D butt slurping... lol...

[trax]

Even if it were one rabbit, in Manitoba in the dead of a harsh winter I would only eat the eyes in an extreme emergency, there are always other things in the wild, even in deeep snow. You living there are better prepared of course but you could find things to eat if had too I know it.

The thing is partner, you're not looking at the other part of my post. How hard might you have to work to get those other food sources is just as important as getting the food. There's not much point in building yourself a shelter and then spending all day wandering around outside, for one, the lack of other fat, protein, mineral and vitamin sources begin to affect your effectiveness and judgement, your body needs more energy just to stay warm, there's plenty to consider. One of the best sources of nutrition in any animal is bone marrow, but I see people toss bones all the time.

My advice to anyone in the scenario I described is, find the rabbit runs (that's easy) and leave snares, learn to check the snares early in the morning, just before or around dawn. If there's water nearby, make one hole in the ice, make yourself an icefishing rig that you can leave there. Check it once or twice a day when you get your water. Gather firewood, if you can, to and from your checking the ice hole and the snares. Utilize as little energy as possible, stay in your shelter as much as possible. Utilize any part of an animal you can, spruce and pine inner bark will provide enough vitamins to stave off scurvy and similar diseases if you make tea out of them.

[Rick]

In the dead of winter in northern Manitoba in a survival situation you will find my starved frozen corpse sitting on a log pointing to a pair of frozen rabbit eyes lying on the ground. If you look real close you'll see a frozen word box over my heard. Build a fire and and thaw it out and you'll here me say, "No freakin' way!".

[Sarge47]

1st; Rick, trust me, if you're starving, truly starving your mind goes into a different place altogether....wait a minute; I said "mind"! Scratch that! Doesn't apply to Rick.:D

Next: This was a REAL Survival school, not a scripted, contrived, controlled program to gain ratings; probably why there hasn't been another one. I also wonder how much tougher those instructors were when the cameras were turned off? Anyway, the point is that we sit around on our fat, lazy, hind-quarters watching these guys on the tube thinking: "yeah, I could Survive!" But the point is you don't have a clue to just WHAT you'll be surviving. It's the old "it can't happen to me" thing. Here's an example: My sister was in a bad car accident a couple months back and suffered two broken wrists and a broken leg.:eek: The guy that hit her was okay as was her husband;(a former Army Ranger, BTW) She was taken to the hospital in Peoria as opposed to a smaller one near-by because of the surgery required. She is learning to walk all over again and now only needs a cane. What if that had been one of us and the other people involved were killed. Add a really bad blizzard and no traffic; what do you do, you can't freakin' move! I thought Hopeak's idea a very good one. It's also why I liked the 6 episodes Discovery did on the "I Shouldn't Be Alive: The Science Of Survival" series. They had 6 Survival experts, including Les Stroud, who went back over the storys move by move and showed what SHOULD have been done! Again, real situations with teaching and knowledge added into the mix.:cool:

[Beo]

Well then Riddle me this Batman: If Jack & Jill went up the hill to get a pail of water, and Jack fell down and broke his crown and Jill coming tumbling after... who the heck did the first aid? Did the kids die of exposure? Or did they crawl to safety? Maybe the big bad wolf ate them. Or the Wolf Pack!!!

[Catfish]

Hokay! I don't give a fat rat's hind parts if you are a fan of Grylli Vanilli, Les Stroud, Roy Mears, or whoever, the way I see it, the problem with these Survival shows are the slick way in which they're made.
Many, many years ago, a BBC News/Magazine show dropped a reporter off on an uninhabited lump of rock off the Scottish coast and left to fend for himself. As I recall, the camera crew were helicoptered in each morning, and out at night but were forbidden to help him in any way. I think he lasted about 7 days before the on-retainer doctor recommended he call it quits.

This was no ex-Special Forces hardcase, or even trained survivalist...just a reg'lar guy put in a situation and left to figure out what to do about it. And all things considered, he did a reasonably good job.

The shows producers admitted later that they'd really made it too hard for him to have any reasonable chance of success, in that the resources available to him (very few trees so little wood for fire or shelter), no other natural shelter, limited food supply even for someone skilled at catching it etc. As one of them said "There's a reason the island was uninhabited."

By definition, a TV show requires a support crew so nobody can ever be in a true survival situation, unless something goes horribly wrong. However, I'd say this show was about as close to being realistic as an artificial set up could be.

[Catfish]

Well then Riddle me this Batman: If Jack & Jill went up the hill to get a pail of water, and Jack fell down and broke his crown and Jill coming tumbling after... who the heck did the first aid? Did the kids die of exposure? Or did they crawl to safety? Maybe the big bad wolf ate them. Or the Wolf Pack!!!
Well, you have to know the full rhyme.

Jack and Jill went up the hill to fetch a pail of water
Jack fell down and broke his crown
And Jill came tumbling after.
Up got Jack, and home did trot As fast as he could caper
He went to bed and bound his head
With vinegar and brown paper.

So basically, the unchivalrous git left her for dead. Although he did have a fractured skull so perhaps he wasn't thinking straight. But I'm willing to bet that pouring vinegar on it didn't help, brown paper or no.

[Beo]

Well, you have to know the full rhyme.

Jack and Jill went up the hill to fetch a pail of water
Jack fell down and broke his crown
And Jill came tumbling after.
Up got Jack, and home did trot As fast as he could caper
He went to bed and bound his head
With vinegar and brown paper.

Or:

Jack and Jill went up the hill to fetch a pail of water
Jack fell down and broke his crown
And Jill came tumbling after.
Up got Jack, and home did stumble and fell into his bed
where he and bled till he was dead:D and nothing comes here after.

[wareagle69]

ray mears rules
he teaches bushcraft bottom line no gimmick here, and that survivorman guy he's ok bought a place down the road a bit from here asked my opinion about a couple of things now look at him so i asked him to come to the gathering so i can give him some more advice

[wareagle69]

and it goes like this
jack and jill went up the hill
each with a candle stick
but jack wasn't so nimble
and jack wasn't so quick
now jacks in the hospital
with a burnt f-n di**

[nell67]

ray mears rules
he teaches bushcraft bottom line no gimmick here, and that survivorman guy he's ok bought a place down the road a bit from here asked my opinion about a couple of things now look at him so i asked him to come to the gathering so i can give him some more advice

That survivorman dude is making a fortune off wht you taught him,LOL!

[nell67]

and it goes like this
jack and jill went up the hill
each with a candle stick
but jack wasn't so nimble
and jack wasn't so quick
now jacks in the hospital
with a burnt f-n di**
I believe that would,kind of hurt???

[RobertRogers]

I don't know about Mears, but BG and LS are infants compared to alot of people who have lived out in the bush for generations.

On TV its more about sensationalism than reality.

[Rick]

Hopeak was right in one of his posts about the loss of knowledge from those who have lived their lives in the bush. Being able to capture that knowledge in some format would be invaluable. The small things, shortcuts and little inventions they used would be the real gold in that knowledge.