Survival Scenario: Moose Hunt

[postman]

This is a purely fictional scenario. You are hunting moose in Northern Ontario during the last week of archery season, which is the first week of October. The weather has been cool and overcast during the day, and has dropped down to near zero at night, and there is rain in the forcast. The terrain is thick Boreal forest, dotted with small lakes, bogs, and swampy area's. There is one logging road that you and your buddies are camped on, using an ATV to taxi each other from stand to stand.
You are wearing used military camo pants and jacket you got at the local surplus store. 100% cotton, with a medium weight quilted jacket, and a camo baseball cap. Your base layer is fleece long underwear you got at Walmart,and wool work socks. Your second layer is a fleece pullover you picked up at the local goodwill. On your feet are a pair of camo hunting boots, that are supposed to be waterproof, and on your hands you are wearing light weight cotton camo gloves and an analog wrist watch. You are wearing a fanny pack that contains the following items: 1 Bic lighter, 1 folding saw, 1 beeswax candle you use to wax your bowstring, 1 extra bowstring, 1 small first aid kit you got at the dollar store, and your lunch: 1 peanut butter sandwich, 1 granola bar, 1 apple, and a bottle of water. On your belt you have your folding knife which is a Gerber Gator, and you have your bow which is a traditional recurve, and your quiver containing six carbon arrows. Three of them have broadheads, and three have small game blunts.
It is five a.m. and you have been dropped near your stand location. You will be picked up at 5 p.m. or sooner if you radio that you want to be picked, or if you shoot a moose. Your stand is about a kilometer into the bush from where you are standing. You need to follow a small game trail in and the stand is on the edge of a beaver pond. The trail is fairly easy to follow during the day, however it is still dark and you are having trouble seeing the path. You realize that you have forgotten your flashlight, but being stubborn you press on sure that you are headed the right way. You keep walking trying to make out the path in the darkness and trying to estimate how far you've gone. Finally you decide that it would be a good idea to wait for daylight so you can see where you are going. When it's finally light enough to see you realize that somewhere in the darkness you have gone the wrong way, and nothing looks familiar. You make a guess at which way the stand should be and head off bush wacking in that direction. About an hour later you realize that you have no idea where you are, so you decide to radio one of your buddies for help. You dig through your fanny pack looking for your two way radio and then to your horror realize that it's back in camp on your bunk right beside your flashlight..............Now what????????

[payne]

Use the watch to find approximate geographic coordinates, and head South I guess (or wherever you need to go to get out of the wilderness)?

[kyratshooter]

What would I do or what would the moron running around in the dark woods for hours at a time do?

[Winter]

Follow your own trail back. If you can't track yourself back, set up camp and make fire.

[Sarge47]

How in the he!! did I get in Canada? Where the he!! did I learn to use a bow? When the he!! did I learn to like peanut butter? Why the he!! would I have a "Gerber Gator folder" on me for a Moose hunt? That knife sucks anyway! I must be having a nightmare so I wake up at home, safe and sound in my wittle bed! :yawnb:

[1stimestar]

You guys are cracking me up!

[kyratshooter]

How about a senerio where Sarge is escaping Illinois?

[hunter63]

I suppose firing three arrows in the air as a distress signal is kinda out of the question....
So did I happen to notice what direction the trail ran before heading out?...should have.
Stop, look and listen for any signs of motors......

If you have bushwhacked your way in, follow you rail back the way you came....how are you trailing skills?

All else fails, stop build a fire......

[BENESSE]

How about a scenario where B is trying to get off the island of Manhattan along with a couple of mil. other people?

[crashdive123]

How about a scenario where B is trying to get off the island of Manhattan along with a couple of mil. other people?

PATH Train (Port Authority Trans-Hudson)
(800) 234-7284
New Jersey-Manhattan commuter train.

[Winter]

Hang glider B.

[Rick]

Hey! Someone shot three arrows in my tent.(lightbulb) Someone must be in trouble in the tops of the trees!


Hold On, I'm Coming

Don't you ever, be sad
Lean on me, when times get bad
When the day come, and you know your down
In a river of trouble, your bout to drown

Hold on, cause I'm coming
Hold on, I'm coming

[Sarge47]

How about a senerio where Sarge is escaping Illinois?

As long as I stay out of Canada I could dig it! :canadian:

[BENESSE]

PATH Train (Port Authority Trans-Hudson)
(800) 234-7284
New Jersey-Manhattan commuter train.

I think I'll walk. :blink:

[ClayPick]

The hypothetical survival situation use to be common here but you don’t see them much anymore. Beaver ponds are notoriously noisy at night, I would have listened before traipsed off into the woods for an hour without knowing where I was going. Banking on the weather, dusk in October would have Vega and Deneb high in the northern sky and heading west. Altair would be bright to the south and heading west. A person could triangulate that with the trails you came in on (if a person took note of their direction in the first place.) A compass is a wonderful thing. Now build a big fire and go to sleep.

[Rick]

The problem with hypothetical situations is the are just too many variables. The OP did a nice job of outlining the situation but one bottle (I assume plastic) of water limits my ability to purify water and how long I can do so for example.

[Batch]

Well, I would back trail my bushwacked trail. Then assemble a signal fire. Look for a makeshift shelter in case you have to stay the night. Find a close enough place that looks like a decent place to sit and hunt. Then around 4 to 4:30 PM, depending on my available fuel and my fire starting ability, I'd light my signal fire and sit and wait and hope. Listening intently for my friends. Shelter for the night if need be and tend the fire the following day.

While waiting I will re-iterate the importance of signalling. Flashlights, one in my pocket, one in my pack ( I also clip in several Inova Micro lights and have the light I carry with my leatherman). Orange blaze tape for marking trails. Frigging radio would have been sweet right about now. Signal mirror.

I'd reflect back on threads about handgun calibers and how if I'd have carried my CCW 9mm I would have 19 rounds of signal shots. That would be 6 3 round or more likely 2 3 round distress shots at 5:30 PM and 6:00 PM. Then single shot locators on the half hour beginning 1 hour after sunrise the next day (that is assuming that this is archery season and gun shots would otherwise be very rare).

I'd keep melting snow in my bottle for water and I would spread the apple and the sandwich out alternating a bite of each every hour or two. Just to keep my spirits up and my stomach from grumbling.

[Rick]

Ooh, sorry, no snow. Maybe rain.

[ClayPick]

There you go, your buddies just have to tell the OPP ( Ontario Provincial Police ) that you have a 9mm handgun in the woods. They would throw out all the stops and get you rounded up. It's just not fair! LOL!

[Batch]

Ooh, sorry, no snow. Maybe rain.

Oh! Damn... You can moose hunt without snow? :blush:

We don't get meese or snow down my way. I missed the rain part. I guess not paying attention to detail is how I got lost in the first place.

[Rick]

That's okay. Sit down here on this log and we'll figure out a way out of this mess.

[Sourdough]

My advise: Hire a competent guide.

[ClayPick]

Or take a dog, they seldom are lost.

[Batch]

My advise: Hire a competent guide.

Why didn't I think of that! {whips out iPhone and tells Siri to call competent guide service}

Hi, yes, I would like to hire you to guide me out of here.

What's that?

Oh, I am right here on this log... Here, I'll text you a picture of the log with its GPS co-ordinates embedded.

[oldtrap59]

Unless I misread the OP I don't see the problem here. You mentioned being able to radio for early pickup, so you must be carrying one. Just push the button and yell HELP. Maybe at least one of your buds knows something about getting around in the woods.

Oldtrap

[Sarge47]

Note to self: Do NOT go big game hunting in the Boreal Forest in Canada, it's too easy to get lost in. However if I do, take a nice fixed blade knife, not a little folder! :sneaky2:

[Sarge47]

Unless I misread the OP I don't see the problem here. You mentioned being able to radio for early pickup, so you must be carrying one. Just push the button and yell HELP. Maybe at least one of your buds knows something about getting around in the woods.

Oldtrap

Yeah, you missed it, read the last line or two in the OP, you left the radio behind. :blush:

[oldtrap59]

Yep I missed it.

Oldtrap

[postman]

LOL, you guys crack me up. Even though this is a hypothetical situation, the sad part is many hunters head into the bush every fall completely unpreparred. Poor equipment, no survival skills or training, and the attitude that it can't happen to them.

[LowKey]

I'm still back on why this dope is wearing cotton anything with fleece over in Canada. I wouldn't do that down here in MA on a cold overcast October day. If he gets at all damp, he's gonna be mighty cold.

[Sarge47]

LOL, you guys crack me up. Even though this is a hypothetical situation, the sad part is many hunters head into the bush every fall completely unpreparred. Poor equipment, no survival skills or training, and the attitude that it can't happen to them.

Okay, but that's not us, right?

[hunter63]

The whole point of these scenarios is to reinforce that fact that there are a LOT of guys /gals headed out unprepared, the buy your gun and a box of shells on Friday nite, go hunting in the morning.

Some times it simply the fact that a lot of folks don't have the bucks for proper gear/clothes, so use what they got, and then again there are some guys/gals that are just "cheap", and won't spend the money.

I'm betting this guy is the guy in camp that is always 'borrowing' something or other...."hey anyone got a fixed bland knife....or compass...or TP or what ever....hard to say, but the fact remains that anyone can get into trouble real quick, with the proper set of circumstances.

[postman]

Lowkey you'd be surprised, most of the guys I see shopping in the scamoflauge section at basspro are looking at the pattern and the price, mostly the price. Just look through a catalogue some day, not much wool available anymore.

Sarge I sure hope that's none of us. And as hard as it is for us to conceive of, the majority of guy's I know that hunt only carry a folding hunting knife because they can't grasp the consept that they may need a knife for something other than gutting an animal. And none of them carry anything to make fire other than a bic lighter or matches (usually the cheap paper ones).

[Rick]

Postman - You are absolutely correct about preparedness. We read about it all the time even with folks that should know better. There was an old saying in the disaster recovery world, "Those that fail to plan, plan to fail," and it's true.

There is actually a lot of wool clothing out there depending on where you look. Most outerwear is just too heavy. Duluth Trading Company has a nice set of wool underwear that is light weight and comfortable. It's expensive but then it's my skin I'm trying to keep warm. I like military surplus, too as well as some of the new synthetics that are fire resistant.

http://www.duluthtrading.com/store/mens/mens-underwear/mens-long-underwear/75035.aspx

[aflineman]

I would build a fire and some sort of shelter. Have a cup of tea and some dinner. Go to sleep watching the fire. Get up in the morning and have some coffee and breakfast. Then head back out to civilization.
(But, then again this is fictional as I don't plan on going bow hunting for moose in Canada any time soon).

[aflineman]

Postman - You are absolutely correct about preparedness. We read about it all the time even with folks that should know better. There was an old saying in the disaster recovery world, "Those that fail to plan, plan to fail," and it's true.

There is actually a lot of wool clothing out there depending on where you look. Most outerwear is just too heavy. Duluth Trading Company has a nice set of wool underwear that is light weight and comfortable. It's expensive but then it's my skin I'm trying to keep warm. I like military surplus, too as well as some of the new synthetics that are fire resistant.

http://www.duluthtrading.com/store/mens/mens-underwear/mens-long-underwear/75035.aspx
Thrift store and surplus places are your friend. So is Rit dye, when the clothes are not an acceptable color.

[payne]

Hold On, I'm Coming

Don't you ever, be sad
Lean on me, when times get bad
When the day come, and you know your down
In a river of trouble, your bout to drown

Hold on, cause I'm coming
Hold on, I'm coming
B.B. King and Eric Clapton: they make such a great duo!

[Batch]

I would build a fire and some sort of shelter. Have a cup of tea and some dinner. Go to sleep watching the fire. Get up in the morning and have some coffee and breakfast. Then head back out to civilization.
(But, then again this is fictional as I don't plan on going bow hunting for moose in Canada any time soon).

Where did you get the tea? Where did you get the coffee? What did you heat the tea and coffee in? Why didn't you just walk out the day before?

[intothenew]

First, for me to have ended up in this predicament it had to have been one heck of a n00b killer's party the night before. You know, dancing around the fire, consuming too much adult beverage, and having to listen to a n00b heckle and crow of his hunting prowess.

Elevation and gridding, pronto. I'm going to use almost every second of light to try and find that road, while still being able to return to my original "lost" position. Climb a tree or find some sort of topography that will give me an overview.

I have sobered up enough to remember that the logging road runs just off of the creek and parallel, I came down stream from camp to get to the let off point. I haven't crossed a ridge so I am still in the same valley. I need to head perp as I can through the valley to find the road.

Once I have found the road, I must assess my general location on it and the time of day.

Near dark, I biv right there. Shelter and a fire.

A reasonable amount of daylight, I have to answer a question or two. Am I the last in line? If so, a hike up the road is in order so that my ride doesn't undershoot me. Is there a pickup location well down stream of me that I am sure to be upstream of? If yes, it's time for some prep to biv. If no, I'm hiking upstream.

I also must consider the age and direction of quad tracks, if any, and which way they were headed last vs my knowledge the pick up routine. Last hunter in line is the cab driver and the tracks head back to camp with a drip of blood every now and again. Dang, I have to walk up stream, and attend another killer party tonight. I think I'll just hide in the bush for one night.

[Rick]

I''ll just play a game of solitaire. Someone is bound to show up and tell me to play the red seven on the black eight.

[LowKey]

I get a lot of my cold weather stuff at surplus. If you are checking price, you don't go to Basspro. You go to Walmart.

[postman]

None of the walmarts in my area sell hunting clothes, at least none that I've been to. I go to a local surplus store quite a bit myself, and the majority of the stuff there has a very high cotton content. You can find some wool but you've really got to look. Part of the problem is knowledge, most of these guys think that wool is old fashioned or that it itches, so they won't wear it. When you tell them why you only wear wool they admit that they didn't know about the insulative properties of wool, but insist they don't need it because they will never get lost or injured or both.

[crashdive123]

This is a purely fictional scenario. You are hunting moose in Northern Ontario during the last week of archery season, which is the first week of October. The weather has been cool and overcast during the day, and has dropped down to near zero at night, and there is rain in the forcast. The terrain is thick Boreal forest, dotted with small lakes, bogs, and swampy area's. There is one logging road that you and your buddies are camped on, using an ATV to taxi each other from stand to stand.
You are wearing used military camo pants and jacket you got at the local surplus store. 100% cotton, with a medium weight quilted jacket, and a camo baseball cap. Your base layer is fleece long underwear you got at Walmart,and wool work socks. Your second layer is a fleece pullover you picked up at the local goodwill. On your feet are a pair of camo hunting boots, that are supposed to be waterproof, and on your hands you are wearing light weight cotton camo gloves and an analog wrist watch. You are wearing a fanny pack that contains the following items: 1 Bic lighter, 1 folding saw, 1 beeswax candle you use to wax your bowstring, 1 extra bowstring, 1 small first aid kit you got at the dollar store, and your lunch: 1 peanut butter sandwich, 1 granola bar, 1 apple, and a bottle of water. On your belt you have your folding knife which is a Gerber Gator, and you have your bow which is a traditional recurve, and your quiver containing six carbon arrows. Three of them have broadheads, and three have small game blunts.
It is five a.m. and you have been dropped near your stand location. You will be picked up at 5 p.m. or sooner if you radio that you want to be picked, or if you shoot a moose. Your stand is about a kilometer into the bush from where you are standing. You need to follow a small game trail in and the stand is on the edge of a beaver pond. The trail is fairly easy to follow during the day, however it is still dark and you are having trouble seeing the path. You realize that you have forgotten your flashlight, but being stubborn you press on sure that you are headed the right way. You keep walking trying to make out the path in the darkness and trying to estimate how far you've gone. Finally you decide that it would be a good idea to wait for daylight so you can see where you are going. When it's finally light enough to see you realize that somewhere in the darkness you have gone the wrong way, and nothing looks familiar. You make a guess at which way the stand should be and head off bush wacking in that direction. About an hour later you realize that you have no idea where you are, so you decide to radio one of your buddies for help. You dig through your fanny pack looking for your two way radio and then to your horror realize that it's back in camp on your bunk right beside your flashlight..............Now what????????

The quick answer, going by what you posted would be to set up camp - prepare to spend the night - keep a fire going adding green vegetation to help getting noticed - wait to be found.

[aflineman]

Where did you get the tea? Where did you get the coffee? What did you heat the tea and coffee in? Why didn't you just walk out the day before?
I don't go into the woods without tea and coffee, but that is me. :) I did not walk out the day before, because sometimes I just need an excuse for an "unplanned" night out in the woods. My Wife only starts to panic now, if I am not home by noon the next day.

[billdawg]

Sit down, relax and think things through. You should have a basic idea of the direction you came from, eg:road runs, N-S. Calmly find your way back to the road, by going back along your path in. If you are stumbling through the woods in the dark, chances are you left plenty of sign to find. You know you will b emissed if not back in the next 11 hours, so you have time to take your time and do it right.
Or if you just watche dBear Grylls, yu run as fast as you can, swinging on a vine and jumping over waterfalls,:chef:, sorry couldn't resist the chance at some cross thread points, lol

[billdawg]

I''ll just play a game of solitaire. Someone is bound to show up and tell me to play the red seven on the black eight.

Dear Lord, I just spit dr pepper all over my keyboard. Nicely played, my friend

[Rick]

Sometimes old jokes are still good. Glad you got a chuckle.

[RockyRaccoon]

None of the walmarts in my area sell hunting clothes, at least none that I've been to. I go to a local surplus store quite a bit myself, and the majority of the stuff there has a very high cotton content. You can find some wool but you've really got to look. Part of the problem is knowledge, most of these guys think that wool is old fashioned or that it itches, so they won't wear it. When you tell them why you only wear wool they admit that they didn't know about the insulative properties of wool, but insist they don't need it because they will never get lost or injured or both.

Dear lord what has this world come to!?!? A Walmart that doesn't sell camo?!?! The Mayans were right... the world is going to end

[Wildthang]

Most of the stuff I have seen at Wallyworld is cotton, maybe I didn't look hard enough!

[hunter63]

Be sure to try one stuff from Walmart....X-large chinese....is a medium USA.....

[lucznik]

This is a purely fictional scenario. Boy, you ain’t kiddin.


You are hunting moose in Northern Ontario during the last week of archery season, which is the first week of October. The weather has been cool and overcast during the day, and has dropped down to near zero at night, and there is rain in the forcast… Before we get into the rest of this post can I just ask; have you ever been moose hunting? Moose are HUGE. You just simply don’t go after them with only such minimal equipment at your disposal. Anyway, I digress…


You are wearing used military camo pants and jacket you got at the local surplus store. 100% cotton, with a medium weight quilted jacket, and a camo baseball cap.
The only mil surplus stuff I own or use is a pair of Swedish wool pants. In October you would never find me hunting big game in the woods in anything but wool.


Your base layer is fleece long underwear you got at Walmart,and wool work socks. I only wear fleece at the office. Fleece is not a good wilderness option, except for kids. It’s OK for them only because it’s pretty cheap and they grow out of stuff way to fast to continuously invest in good clothes.


Your second layer is a fleece pullover you picked up at the local goodwill. You get WOOL, not fleece, at the goodwill. You can buy fleece just about anywhere cheap. However, you can often find excellent wool clothes for super cheap. Even at the goodwill you’ve got to have some standards.


…on your hands you are wearing light weight cotton camo gloves and an analog wrist watch. Not in this lifetime. Again, wool is your friend.


You are wearing a fanny pack that contains the following items:
1 Bic lighter,
1 folding saw,
1 beeswax candle you use to wax your bowstring,
1 extra bowstring,
1 small first aid kit you got at the dollar store,
your lunch:
1 peanut butter sandwich,
1 granola bar,
1 apple,
and a bottle of water. My pack may have those items (except the PB sandwich, yuck!) but, it would have a whole lot more too. Going back to what I was saying before, moose are HUGE animals. You don’t drag them through the forest like you do a whitetail deer.


On your belt you have your folding knife which is a Gerber Gator, Not likely. A Bear Gryll’s ULTIMATE KNIFE, maybe… (OK NOT!)... AT minimum for a moose hunt, on my belt would probably be a Buck Alpha Hunter. In my jacket pocket would be a Buck Mini Alpha Hunter, in my pants pocket would be a Victorinox Fieldmaster, and in my pack would be a Buck UltraLite folder.


and you have your bow which is a traditional recurve, NOW you’re talking!! Though mine would be a 62” NTN R/D bamboo-backed yew longbow, a recurve is also an acceptable and welcome option.


and your quiver containing six carbon arrows. Three of them have broadheads, and three have small game blunts. NOOOO!! You just ruined it! Carbon arrows are the tool of the Devil. Also, you don't take three broadheads after moose. You take at least twice that.

If you’re going to shoot traditional, you shoot WOODIES! My personal preference is for river cane arrows. They are called "nature’s carbon" for good reason and they have SO much more character. I fletch mine with two 5 ½”, L wing, Autumn Brown, shield cut hen feathers and a cock feather that is a barred Autumn brown. Makes a beautiful arrow.

I also like poplar as a good arrow shaft; quite heavy, easy to straighten, and very durable. These I usually fletch with 5 ½”, R Wing, shield cut feathers in some combination of brighter colors (usually green & yellow or orange)The shafts are more difficult to stain so I either leave them their natural color or I plan on spending lot’s of extra time waiting for the stain to penetrate.


You realize that you have forgotten your flashlight, but being stubborn you press on sure that you are headed the right way. I never forget my flashlight. I have one on my belt and another in my pocket right now. In my pack I keep an extra two (one flashlight and one headlamp). IMO, flashlights are one of the most overlooked and underappreciated tools of survival.


Now what???????? Now you hunker down, eat your sammich, and wait. Next time, come more prepared and use your head from the beginning.

[Rick]

lucznik - You forget your leash to lead the moose out of the woods. That's a lot easier than carrying pieces parts.

[letslearntogether47]

I've hunted black powder season in 0 deg weather with a wind chill.
And a miltary field jacket with liner and layered clothing kept out the cold.

But in that senario,hunkering down for the night with fire and shelter would be my choice.

[lucznik]

lucznik - You forget your leash to lead the moose out of the woods. That's a lot easier than carrying pieces parts. So THAT'S what I've been missing!!

And here I've always done the bone it out, portion the meat into manageable pieces on a pack frame and start walking.

[postman]

Like the original post says this is a purely fictional scenario. That being said though, every fall there are hundreds of idiots that venture into the the Northern Ontario wilderness in pursuit of moose that are less equipped than the the guy in the scenario.

Yes lucznik I hunt moose every fall with traditional archery gear that I make myself, I use oak shafted arrows tipped with 145 grain Grizzly single bevel broadheads. In almost 30 years of hunting I've taken 9 moose, all with a bow, some have been packed out and some have been easier. I only wear wool, always have a complete survival kit, and would never carry a gerber gator, or a peanut butter sandwich. Like I said this is fictional. Nice to hear from another trad archer, I like mention of the bamboo backed yew longbow, sounds nice. The bow I'm currently using is bamboo back and belly with an IPE core, 72" ntn, 65lbs @ 28". very sweet shooting bow.

[Northern Horseman]

I'd be the guy back at the base camp shooting off bear bangers at regular intervals, (about ten minutes apart) trying to give him guidance as to where to come back to, that would give him ninety minutes to get his bearings.
I guess you might also give off a whistle blast every five minutes just for the extra help if he's close enough.
If your ATV has no horn install one, this too would be a good signal method to bring home your wayward sheep.