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View Full Version : Deadfalls, no bait, what do?



justin_baker
04-29-2010, 01:34 AM
Lets say im surviving primitively and i make a deadfall but dont have any bait. I guess i could lay it on a trail but why is an animal going to run into a rock?
Are there any natural things i can use as bait?
Or would making snares be a better bet?

randyt
04-29-2010, 06:28 AM
i would still consider using the dead fall on a trail. make a figure four with the horizontal trigger low, low enough that your target animal will attempt to step over it and trip it. set the trap in a bottle neck. snares would be a better bet though but maybe snares aren't available.

your_comforting_company
04-29-2010, 08:07 AM
In one of my books, it shows a heavy log being used as the deadfall with a few sticks over the ground and a trigger system that works off a pressure plate (fashioned out of sticks). It looks like a doorway of sticks on the game trail and if they use the trail, they'll step on it without even knowing it was there.
You don't necessarily need bait if your trap is designed to be triggered by stepping.
I haven't made one of this type yet, so no pictures. I'll try to describe it.
You have two uprights for the 'doorway' with a stick (stick A) tied across the top. The top crossmember should be strong enough to hold up the weight of your log. a piece of cordage (string A) goes around the log loose enough to wrap over the top brace to hook into your trigger, which is a little stick (1/2" thick x 3" long) (trigger). Another crossmember (stick B) is added to the trap just below the trigger-wedge crossmember, but the second one is not lashed to the framework because it needs to slide down to release the trigger-pin. Another string (string B) is tied from this piece to the ground panel platform. The ground panel doesn't sit right on the ground, it's raised enough that when the animal steps on it, it can move down and pull your loose crossmember (stick B) away from the pin (trigger), releasing the trap. Build up a step platform so when the critter walks through, it won't matter where he steps as long as he steps through the trap.
Step on the platform, it pullls string B, which is attached to Stick B. Stick B moves down away from the bottom of trigger set on fulcrum at stick A. Trigger flips out releasing string A and log. Critter gets a nice bump on the head and you get to eat. No bait.

After reading this, I can see I'm gonna have to make one and take pictures so's I can explain it better.

your_comforting_company
04-29-2010, 08:10 AM
you can also use "tripwire" snare tactics, like the ones listed here:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/3478144/Six-Primitive-Traps-for-Catching-Food-in-the-Woods
particularly, trap #2 and #4. no bait "tripwire" traps.
With a little imagination, these traps can be adapted to just about any situation and not need bait.

Ole WV Coot
04-29-2010, 05:34 PM
Deadfalls are desperate measures that seldom work the way you want. A figure 4 with natural rocks, plants etc to make a long funnel hoping and I do mean hoping that an animal will trip it and get caught. Stick with snares.

trax
04-30-2010, 04:22 PM
what Coot said, absolutely. How difficult is it to pack along a small roll of snare wire?

Rick
04-30-2010, 04:29 PM
If you just have to use the deadfall, then check rotted logs for grubs or beneath rocks. Depending on how many you find, you may choose the grubs over messing with the deadfall.

Alaskan Survivalist
04-30-2010, 04:54 PM
What's bait? Does it just come in plastic bags labeled "BAIT" or can the definition be expanded to include what your prey eats? It's food scource is the best place to look for game in the first place. The only part of the OP that made any sense to me was asking about natural things that could be used for bait. If there is no bait the odds of anything else being there is not good.

rwc1969
04-30-2010, 06:29 PM
THat is one helluva good point AS.

Rick
04-30-2010, 06:41 PM
Actually....that might well apply in Alaska but more "domesticated" have learned to eat just about anything and everything. Squirrels, for example, are opportunists and will take just about everything. Even those that live in the woods, I'm sure, have had some form of human food. While thinking like your intended target is good stuff, having even a piece of chewing gum could net you dinner. At least around here.

justin_baker
04-30-2010, 09:36 PM
What's bait? Does it just come in plastic bags labeled "BAIT" or can the definition be expanded to include what your prey eats? It's food scource is the best place to look for game in the first place. The only part of the OP that made any sense to me was asking about natural things that could be used for bait. If there is no bait the odds of anything else being there is not good.

Well, if they are thousands of acorns in the forest, and i put one acorn under a deadfall, the chances of a squirrel going for it arent super high. If i put peanut butter or crackers under it though, a squirrel will go crazy from the salts, sugars, ect. in the food.

crashdive123
04-30-2010, 10:17 PM
Well, if they are thousands of acorns in the forest, and i put one acorn under a deadfall, the chances of a squirrel going for it arent super high. If i put peanut butter or crackers under it though, a squirrel will go crazy from the salts, sugars, ect. in the food.

If you set it right, the squirrel won't get that far. Just sayin'.

Rick
04-30-2010, 10:19 PM
Sadly, I ate the peanut butter and crackers and Justin Baker went hungry.

Alaskan Survivalist
04-30-2010, 10:19 PM
Well, if they are thousands of acorns in the forest, and i put one acorn under a deadfall, the chances of a squirrel going for it arent super high. If i put peanut butter or crackers under it though, a squirrel will go crazy from the salts, sugars, ect. in the food.

You almost asked the right question.

your_comforting_company
05-01-2010, 10:15 AM
I'm sticking with the idea that a properly placed trap of the right kind doesn't require ANY bait.
There's a Pow-Wow in a town about 75 miles from here today, and we are supposed to be going in a little while if the weather shapes up.
When I get back (if we go) I'll make one of the traps I described above, take pics showing how to set it up, and how it works. No bait deadfall. Watch for it!
Even the bird trap from the link I posted above (I make them a little differently) doesn't require bait. It only requires the bird land on the perch.
Ideally this is the kind of set-up you want so you don't have to spend your time and energy looking for bait. All these require is that the animal do it's normal thing.. walk the same trail it always walks, or behave as it normally does.
I guess it really depends on what you are trapping, and where.

Rick
05-01-2010, 10:20 AM
YCC - We have tons of chipmunks. I generally live trap them and haul their little furry butts off. I use no bait of any kind and I catch them all the time. I just set out a live trap along an area that they use. They will run right through it and trip it. I wouldn't want to bet dinner on it but it works pretty well.

http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/300/cc/ccbf1639-02a8-4ec6-b93d-409c28ea75ef_300.jpg

your_comforting_company
05-01-2010, 10:35 AM
If you had no other way to get dinner.. you'd bet on it, I bet :tongue_smilie:

Rick
05-01-2010, 10:51 AM
Of course. My point was that setting a deadfall the right way, in the right place, without bait might well secure a meal.

Alaskan Survivalist
05-01-2010, 11:28 AM
You guys will still be using bait whether you are aware of it or not. Maybe not in your trap but they will have reason for being on a trail. I figure ways to apply basic rules to any given situation. It is easier than memorizing different methods for each situation and ignoring the basic principals. Sometimes it may be as simple as just leaning a stick against a tree to give your squirel an easier path up its tree to control or predict its movement. Each situation will be different. It's a way of thinking. Every craftsman will encounter jobs he has never done before but applying what he knows figures out how to get the job done. Same, same.

your_comforting_company
05-12-2010, 09:46 PM
Pretty basic. I said I'd make one and take pictures, but I didn't say it would be in the woods. I built this in the yard for the sake of showing a no-bait deadfall. This would normally be set up on a well used trail and works if the animal simply walks the trail it normally does. You want it set up in a bottleneck type area. I'm also using old plastic baling twine because I have it readily available (found a huge roll at the dump) and frankly, I was too tired after work to be bothered making my own rope lol.

Two uprights, on either side of the trail, and a header stick to tie them together. your crosstie needs to be strong enough to hold up your deadfall log.
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3976.jpg

A big heavy log to do the smashing. tie a loop around it with about 6" extra. this will make sense in a minute.
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3977.jpg

The trigger assembly. A short stick used as the lever which holds up the log, and it wedges against a small stick that is long enough to reach from one upright to the other.
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3978.jpg

The actual trigger. This is suspended off the ground and ties to the smaller wedge stick up top. I tied the right hand side to the upright about 3/4" off the ground, and the left hand side of my trigger is suspended by the string that connects it to the wedge.
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3979.jpg
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3980.jpg
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3981.jpg

The whole assembly
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3982.jpg

It works on the idea that the animal will step on the stick.. we need to increase the surface area of the stick, so we build a platform on it with whatever sticks and leaves we have laying around.
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3983.jpg
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg184/your_comforting_company/Primitive%20Skills/DSCN3985.jpg

Normally brush would go on either side, to help the trap blend in and to aide in narrowing the path. If the animal walks the path it normally does, it's gonna get clobbered.
The idea for this trap comes directly from "Naked Into the Wilderness". I can only take credit for color pictures :D

justin_baker
05-13-2010, 12:19 AM
Wow, thats a pretty sweet design ycc, im actually going to try that. Did you get that from somewhere or did you make it up yourself?

your_comforting_company
05-13-2010, 06:08 AM
The idea for this trap comes directly from "Naked Into the Wilderness". I can only take credit for color pictures :D

I read about it in a book with black and white pics. Took a little deciphering to figure it out when there is no contrast in the greys.

U makin fun of my little toe? I lost it to a renegade squirrel and have ever since sworn vengeance on them.
Justs kidding.
It's still attached, It's just tiny.

I have a few others to build and get pics of. There are a few trap designs out there that don't require bait and several of the ones that are using bait can be adapted to work without it, since that is what the OP was about. Might take me a while to get around to making them all and getting pictures. I even have a mod for that squirrel pole snare. Hopefully over the summer while me and the boys are out, we'll get a chance to set some of these up in real life scenarios and see how well / if they work.
Stay tuned!

AirborneEagles
08-06-2010, 11:01 PM
Lets say im surviving primitively and i make a deadfall but dont have any bait. I guess i could lay it on a trail but why is an animal going to run into a rock?
Are there any natural things i can use as bait?
Or would making snares be a better bet?

One idea that does work for mice or squirrels or even chipmunks is to dig a hole with your hands or stick (rock is nice) and make it about 3 feet down. Then put a stick across the top with a pine nut dangling on about 4 inches of vine (string) or nice stringy and strong weed from the middle or the stick hanging down with the nut (or whatever you want to use as bait) tied to the end of the string (vine). When the rodent or animal goes to try and get the nut, they fall into the hole and you just sit and watch till it happens and you have food. If you like mice, easy to catch mice this way. Chipmunks are fun to catch this way too.

You can also add a row of nuts going down the string (vine) tied to the string as well. Using a small heavy rock at the very end of the string will also help from them pulling it up and getting the food.

klickitat
08-07-2010, 12:33 AM
I trapped for years and I am with Ole WV Coot on this one SNARES!

SARKY
08-07-2010, 04:47 AM
The problem I have with dead falss, especially unbaited ones is, without the bait to distract the critter the delay time for the fall via the trip system to do it's work gives the critter time to evade being killed.

randyt
08-07-2010, 07:28 AM
it's all about effort versus results and snares take less work in my opinion but a fella should know about deadfalls because of what if. what if you found yourself with out good snare material.