View Full Version : Should FEMA Sell Tainted Katrina Trailers?
Should FEMA Sell Tainted Katrina Trailers?
Idiots. Even thinking of selling these things is pure lunacy. Without a doubt, many would ultimately be used as dwellings.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/greenhouse/post/2010/03/should-fema-sell-formaldehyde-tainted-katrina-trailers/1
This is an interesting story with a long history. There are a couple of trailer factories in the north part of the state that made those and a LOT of folks in Indiana were hauling them. A couple of my neighbors were taking them down south. The first ones that were purchased were good quality trailers. Dealerships throughout the Midwest had them on their lots for sale. The government called each of the dealerships and purchased everything they had then contracted the two factories to turn them out as quickly as they could. I guess I don't have to go any further with that.
The agreement with the Trailer Manufacturers Assoc. was the government would not sell them for housing once they were finished with them. The TMA didn't want a glut of used trailers to flood the market and drive prices down. The original plan was to destroy them. Of course, people stayed in them far longer than anyone had envisioned so many of the manufactured problems came to light. And thousands sat empty waiting to be used. So when someone finally opened the doors on any of them the smell of formaldehyde was overpowering.
FEMA, where quality is job one. No, that doesn't fit.
FEMA, Sharp Minds, Sharp Products. Nuhuh.
FEMA, Let's Make Things Better. Nope.
FEMA, How Do You Spell Relief? I don't think so. I'll keep working on a slogan.
Pal334
03-14-2010, 03:23 AM
Duuuuh: "The Federal Emergency Management Agency, which has deemed them unfit to live in"
Other than they are unhealthy, apparently violate the purchase agreement, why take on the long term health liability? seems to be a no brainer. Burn them down!
pete lynch
03-14-2010, 05:21 AM
I say burn 'em.
They weren't meant for permanent living.
Winnie
03-14-2010, 05:57 AM
Being a real dolly here, but why are they tainted with Formaldehyde? And as they are, why on earth were people living in them in New Oleans?
crashdive123
03-14-2010, 07:01 AM
Being a real dolly here, but why are they tainted with Formaldehyde? And as they are, why on earth were people living in them in New Oleans?
Formaldehyde in its liquid form is used in the manufacturing of quite a few products. The glues that bind together plywood or press board often contain formaldehyde. It's actually used in quite a few products as a preservative. The formaldehyde will then off gas, or vaporize. If the levels of formaldehyde that were used in the manufacturing process of whatever is now off gassing were too high, then it becomes a dangerous airborne contaminant. I'm not sure why the levels of formaldehyde were so high in the manufacturing of these trailers - seems like the quality control processes broke down during the rush to get them out.
It is/was not only the people of New Orleans, but many from the Gulf Coast area following Hurricane Katrina. They were intended to be used as temporary emergency housing for those that lost their homes during the storm.
Winnie
03-14-2010, 08:58 AM
Ah thanks Crash, I know the dangers of formaldehyde, I just didn't know the application in this instance.
According to a Washington Post article back in 2007, the average cost to purchase these trailers was $18,620 each.
Winnie - This will give you an idea of what it looked like.
http://www.southernstudies.org/FEMA_trailer_park.jpg
Here are some awaiting disposal. Believe it or not, these were dragged from the Gulf Coast to just outside Cumberland, MD. This is just 1000 of the 100,000 purchased.
http://www.brokerphoto.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/dsc_0007-1-1.jpg
You all may be surprised to learn the current administration is proposing to send these trailers to Haiti. Yep.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/feb/01/us-lawmakers-push-fema-trailers-for-haiti/
Camp10
03-14-2010, 09:16 AM
There were dozens of these for sale down in Auburn at the mall last summer. I didnt go to look at them but from what I could see driving by, they had little or no windows. I was told the price by a co-worker that stopped to look but I really cant remember...it was cheap. I remember thinking at the time that you could probably gut them and re-do the inside for much (much,much)less than if you were to buy a new one.
nell67
03-14-2010, 09:39 AM
Anyone bought a new mobile home recently????
The double wide I had set up after my house burned,came with a warning poster hung inside that stated formaldehyde was used in the building process,and yes,you could smell it.
LowKey
03-14-2010, 09:47 AM
Almost all plastic-laminate wall panels, carpets, fiberboard building materials and kitchen floor tiles use Formaldehyde in the manufacture process. All of those things have non-formaldehyde counterparts. But guess what? They cost more.
The government should abide by the builder's contract and destroy them or break them down into component parts and recycle, rather than burning.
Or determine the time to offgas. It does go away eventually if not enclosed and reabsorbed.
Justin Case
03-14-2010, 10:16 AM
I dont get it ? They are newer trailers,, I think FEMA may have meant that they are not fit to live in Perm. ? I would love to have one , Much better than being homeless, (which is a reality I may be facing soon ) , I WISH I had one,,
Guardian News of the UK has several pretty pictures that show the trailers and depict mold and several other "problems." :innocent:
There are 10 more pics here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2008/jun/06/hurricanekatrina.photography?picture=334649135&morepage
http://static.guim.co.uk/Guardian/world/gallery/2008/jun/06/hurricanekatrina.photography/GD7507566@-FILE--In-this-March--6967.jpg (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2008/jun/06/hurricanekatrina.photography?picture=334645492)
http://static.guim.co.uk/Guardian/world/gallery/2008/jun/06/hurricanekatrina.photography/GD7452177@POST-SULPHUR,-LA---MA-6685.jpg (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2008/jun/06/hurricanekatrina.photography?picture=334645504)
Justin Case
03-14-2010, 10:36 AM
Well Now THATS pretty disgusting ,, did the people just ruin them ? again, I may be living in the bushes soon, I couldn't "buy" one, But I would like to have one, I would clean it up,
,, did the people just ruin them ?
All I can say is that there's no way my kids would ever sleep on something like that when a lousy quart of bleach and some water would clean it up, even if only for one day. :sneaky2:
Justin Case
03-14-2010, 10:44 AM
There isn't any carpet on the floor? weren't those trailers new when they brought them in ? doesnt make any sense, they must have been flooded or something, Lots of people live in RV trailers .
There isn't any carpet on the floor? weren't those trailers new when they brought them in ? doesnt make any sense, they must have been flooded or something, Lots of people live in RV trailers .
The UK Guardian News picture captions state that many of the trailers also leak and have mold problems. Look at the blinds and the couch in the second pic. It may have been necessary to rip the carpet out.
Justin Case
03-14-2010, 11:06 AM
Yes, The plywood on the floor even looks wet.
If the things were gutted, they could be used as storage sheds.
If they get sent to Haiti, we'll be crucified by the international community, and probably rightfully so. That would be a first........ :innocent:
Here's an idea......... Alaska is 586,412 square miles. We could saturate the state with emergency weather survival shelters - one for every 5.86 square miles - and float weather ballons in the air to mark their locations. We could stock each one with a few supplies and some heating fuel and some tequilla and vanilla creamer. We could put Sourdough in charge of the program........ :innocent:
Justin Case
03-14-2010, 11:18 AM
Sound like a good plan, Please put at least One of them here on the river :)
Sourdough
03-14-2010, 11:21 AM
First we need to RAISE the Federal Income Tax to pay for building them in the first place, and bump up the Federal Income Tax a little more to cover the cost of destroying them.
Well at least they don't have Radon Gas.
Everyone involved, government employees and private industry management employees should receive promotions, and pay raises.
Winnie
03-14-2010, 11:24 AM
I hope you all don't take offence and I am including my own Govt in this, but I'm constantly stunned at the outright stupidity of the "buyers" for Govt. A lot of this is their own fault. By suddenly flooding the manufacturers with orders it's pretty obvious that the first thing to go is QC(no offence Ken). Some manufacturing companies are out and out thieves producing poor quality goods and charging the Govt top dollar, others take on these jobs out of desperation to keep their order books full. Either way, it's QC and the end user who suffers. Having said that, I would rather have walked away and slept in a tent before I'd have let Winnie jnr so much as look inside a "dwelling" such as that shown in the photo.
Then again, being made homeless/poor is no excuse whatsover to allow your home, however temporary to get in that state in the first place.
I hope you all don't take offence and I am including my own Govt in this, but I'm constantly stunned at the outright stupidity of the "buyers" for Govt. A lot of this is their own fault. By suddenly flooding the manufacturers with orders it's pretty obvious that the first thing to go is QC(no offence Ken). Some manufacturing companies are out and out thieves producing poor quality goods and charging the Govt top dollar, others take on these jobs out of desperation to keep their order books full. Either way, it's QC and the end user who suffers. Having said that, I would rather have walked away and slept in a tent before I'd have let Winnie jnr so much as look inside a "dwelling" such as that shown in the photo.
Then again, being made homeless/poor is no excuse whatsover to allow your home, however temporary to get in that state in the first place.
These problems would have been avoided entirely had they contracted with Crash and me (Q.C.) to inspect each trailer for the reasonable cost of $100 per unit. :)
Justin Case
03-14-2010, 11:32 AM
Then again, being made homeless/poor is no excuse whatsover to allow your home, however temporary to get in that state in the first place.
I agree Winnie,, Maybe she was waiting for the FEMA maid ? LOL (only 1/2 kidding)
Justin Case
03-14-2010, 11:33 AM
These problems would have been avoided entirely had they contracted with Crash and me (Q.C.) to inspect each trailer for the reasonable cost of $100 per unit. :)
(Over Qualified ) :online2long:
Winnie
03-14-2010, 11:34 AM
These problems would have been avoided entirely had they contracted with Crash and me (Q.C.) to inspect each trailer for the reasonable cost of $100 per unit. :)
I quite agree, just think of all that money flowing into the coffers of DOC(well you are WSF QC afterall:innocent:)
BLEUXDOG
03-14-2010, 07:36 PM
My folks lived in one of these trailers for almost 9 months. There was a phone number you could call and someone would come out and help you with problems you were having with the trailer.
A lot of these trailers were name brand travel trailers with slides.
When we bought our travel trailer it took us a couple of weeks of airing out to get the fumes out of the trailer.
These trailers were to help people while they "Helped" themselves.
The pictures you are looking at are typical of the "You owe me" attitude after the hurricane. I guess we owed a clean up crew too.
When you read about folks living in them for 5 years the first question I ask is "Why?" Why one earth would you want to do that? Of course, if you're life has been one of handouts this may have been the best thing to come along in a while.
Old GI
03-15-2010, 09:08 AM
After Hurricane Ivan (in 2004), FEMA had a sales site for trailers in my county. Most were really torn up. That photo was a mild case. Some had toilets ripped out, wiring ripped out, flooring removed, etc. and the filth was terrible. Survival would have to be at stake for me to spend one night in one of the used ones.
rebel
03-15-2010, 09:24 AM
No accountability on several levels.
canid
03-15-2010, 09:43 AM
According to a Washington Post article back in 2007, the average cost to purchase these trailers was $18,620 each.
Winnie - This will give you an idea of what it looked like.
http://www.southernstudies.org/FEMA_trailer_park.jpg
Here are some awaiting disposal. Believe it or not, these were dragged from the Gulf Coast to just outside Cumberland, MD. This is just 1000 of the 100,000 purchased.
http://www.brokerphoto.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/dsc_0007-1-1.jpg
You all may be surprised to learn the current administration is proposing to send these trailers to Haiti. Yep.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/feb/01/us-lawmakers-push-fema-trailers-for-haiti/
i find that to be the height of idiocy. haven't we designed many, more cost effective short term emergency shelters throughout the generations?
not to suggest that they are the best solution, but even with the prices of steel these days, wouldn't good old fashioned quonset hut type structures be like 10x less wastefull? a simple structure like that could just as readily be fitted with low cost, modular amenities like tiolets, sinks, stoves, etc.
maybe i'm on the wrong page here.
Old GI
03-15-2010, 11:16 AM
Short term???? There's a place for accountability to start.
canid
03-15-2010, 11:24 AM
by short term, i nean non-permanent.
obviously we wouldn't want to leave a bunch of quonset huts in the superdome, it would impede gameplay...
2dumb2kwit
03-15-2010, 11:39 AM
Short term???? There's a place for accountability to start.
Check this story out. It's from back in May, but it's an eye opener.
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/may/06/nation/na-fema-trailers6
Post-Katrina trailer residents fearful as eviction day looms
FEMA, having pushed back its deadline several times, says the last 4,600 dwellings must be cleared by May 30. But many occupants are poor, ill or elderly, with no place to go, housing advocates say.
Though federal law prohibited FEMA from providing emergency housing for longer than 18 months, officials repeatedly extended the deadline in acknowledgment of the scope of the destruction. At the same time, some local governments -- worried about blight and eager to move on -- used zoning and permitting rules to pressure trailer residents to get out of the units and into more permanent housing.
In Louisiana, housing advocates point to state programs that have done little to help. A much-touted plan to build tiny, permanent "Katrina cottages" -- funded with millions in federal money -- has not produced a single unit.
A $869-million state program, also federally funded, targeted more than 18,000 damaged rental units, but had resulted in fewer than 1,200 repairs by late March, according to the New Orleans Times-Picayune newspaper.
This is what I envision.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUauH7is7qY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faUBbz_EncE&feature=related
From what I hear is that some folks don't know that the black water tank needs a little water in the bottom or crap will stick to the bottom and build up.
Just the thought turns my stomach.
canid
03-15-2010, 01:07 PM
i'd live in one of these; i've stayed in worse:
http://dzifoundation.org/newsletters/pakishelter.jpg
http://blog.quarterliving.com/wp-content/plugins/wp-o-matic/cache/9c845_concrete-canvas-shelters.jpg
this one is touted as costing $100:
http://blog.quarterliving.com/wp-content/plugins/wp-o-matic/cache/c29d1_hexayurt.jpg
Justin Case
03-15-2010, 01:13 PM
Whats the last Pic ? Looks like Balloon boys back yard ? :alien:
2dumb2kwit
03-15-2010, 01:15 PM
This is what I envision.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUauH7is7qY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faUBbz_EncE&feature=related
From what I hear is that some folks don't know that the black water tank needs a little water in the bottom or crap will stick to the bottom and build up.
Just the thought turns my stomach.
Soooooo...would that make ****alagmites or ****alactites?
I always get those two confused.:blushing:
canid
03-15-2010, 02:13 PM
it's apparently called a 'hexa-yurt' or some such.
Justin Case
03-15-2010, 02:16 PM
Whats the big ball thing?
canid
03-15-2010, 02:20 PM
i can see how it might be hard to recognize it without the giant tower:
http://sfopera.com/press/DoctorAtomic/ABombWHamilton3.jpg
http://www.lmd.polytechnique.fr/%7Emenut/figs/test_nucleaire_Nevada_Test_Site.jpg
From what I hear is that some folks don't know that the black water tank needs a little water in the bottom or crap will stick to the bottom and build up.
Just the thought turns my stomach.
I had a hard time posting this but thought some use a porta potty or something that they may want to consider this.
we wouldn't want to leave a bunch of quonset huts in the superdome, it would impede gameplay...
"Brees steps into the pocket and let's it fly. Troy Humphrey is at the New Orleans 40. What a catch!" He slides through the Quonset hut completely cutting off the defense but they have a surprise waiting for him on the other side. Ooooh, that has to hurt, Matt."
"He made great use of the Quonset hut, Kenny. I don't think anyone has a greater command of the offensive use of the Quonset hut than New Orleans. Brees proved that last week against Tennessee when he hit Dan Campbell inside a Quonset hut."
LowKey
03-15-2010, 07:35 PM
And 80% of the country is relying on the government to 'help them' in the event of an emergency.
Ah-yuh.
Boker
03-15-2010, 07:53 PM
This is an interesting story with a long history. There are a couple of trailer factories in the north part of the state that made those and a LOT of folks in Indiana were hauling them. A couple of my neighbors were taking them down south. The first ones that were purchased were good quality trailers. Dealerships throughout the Midwest had them on their lots for sale. The government called each of the dealerships and purchased everything they had then contracted the two factories to turn them out as quickly as they could. I guess I don't have to go any further with that.
The agreement with the Trailer Manufacturers Assoc. was the government would not sell them for housing once they were finished with them. The TMA didn't want a glut of used trailers to flood the market and drive prices down. The original plan was to destroy them. Of course, people stayed in them far longer than anyone had envisioned so many of the manufactured problems came to light. And thousands sat empty waiting to be used. So when someone finally opened the doors on any of them the smell of formaldehyde was overpowering.
FEMA, where quality is job one. No, that doesn't fit.
FEMA, Sharp Minds, Sharp Products. Nuhuh.
FEMA, Let's Make Things Better. Nope.
FEMA, How Do You Spell Relief? I don't think so. I'll keep working on a slogan.
Reminds me of the old David Lettermen Joke:
Ford: Quality is job one, putting out the fire is job two.
I'd buy one of these trailers for my mother-in-law. Just sayin...
Justin Case
03-15-2010, 09:12 PM
I hear Trailers make great Tornado Lures :innocent:
I'd buy one of these trailers for my mother-in-law. Just sayin...
I hear Trailers make great Tornado Lures :innocent:
Boker knows that, Justin. :innocent:
rebel
03-15-2010, 09:45 PM
I hear Trailers make great Tornado Lures :innocent:
I knew a guy and he said that was God's plan so that we could get new pole dancers.
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